• Valbrandur
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    67
    ·
    1 year ago

    The invading Russian forces have basically failed their first goal; to fully take over Ukraine.

    …When has Russia ever claimed this?

    • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆OP
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      42
      ·
      1 year ago

      I expect that we’ll see libs acting increasingly more unhinged as it becomes increasingly clear that project Ukraine is collapsing. They’ve become deeply emotionally invested in this as the one righteous war they can feel good about, and now the rug is being pulled out from under them.

  • Soviet Snake
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    49
    ·
    1 year ago

    Jesus christ, i thought this people have already accepted reality. Ukraine is literally hopping on one foot with three toes and these bastsrds think theyre winning.

    • 420stalin69@hexbear.net
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      40
      ·
      1 year ago

      They’ve defined victory as Russia occupying Lviv and anything less than that means Ukraine is winning.

      News about recruitment issues and women in the trenches doesn’t reach their feed or if it does it’s a victory for feminism.

      • Valbrandur
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        32
        ·
        1 year ago

        Oh who would have guessed we would live to see the same copium that was used for the Winter War’s outcome, all over again.

    • SadArtemis🏳️‍⚧️
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      5
      ·
      1 year ago

      They’ve never accepted reality anywhere else- in foreign affairs or the steady decline in material conditions for the masses at home. No reason to think they would start accepting it now. I really look forward to the times ahead, when their despicable world shatters around them, though.

    • Tankiedesantski [he/him]@hexbear.net
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      34
      ·
      1 year ago

      “Democratic” fills the same niche these days that “Christian” filled in the days of the European colonial empires. Anyone who wasn’t nominally Christian was automatically evil and had no rights. Anyone who was deemed nominally Christian was to be supported against non-Christiams, even if they were doing decidedly un-Christ-like things like stealing, raping, and murdering.

      It’s just a thin veneer of in-group/out-group distinctions applied to politically expedient bad things to make them look justifiable.

      • v_pp
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        26
        ·
        1 year ago

        Then:

        We have to bring civilization to those savages!

        Now:

        We have to bring democracy to those terrorists!

    • CannotSleep420
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      30
      ·
      1 year ago

      But don’t you see: all the banned parties are putlerist, so banning them was actually good for democracy!

    • 420stalin69@hexbear.net
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      27
      ·
      1 year ago

      And you pass a law requiring all media to be organized under a state entity and you pass another law to criminalize any news that paints Russia in a positive light and then enforce this law to target journalists who report on Russian victories.

      This is what democracy looks like.

  • CoolerOpposide [none/use name]@hexbear.net
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    45
    ·
    edit-2
    1 year ago

    Ukraine has had 20% of its territory occupied uncontested for 2 straight years, and said territory formally annexed into Russia with little (if any) pushback from the local population.

    Here’s why that means Ukraine is winning:

    • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆OP
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      38
      ·
      1 year ago

      This was my fav comment in the the thread hands down. Turns out all NATO had to do was to fly 200 F35s in and that would be the end of Russian army 😂

      Because lobbing shells at eachother is Soviet doctrine, not NATO. NATO doctrine is to bomb the everloving shit out of someone with massive air superiority. If NATO decided to send 200 F35s to Ukraine, there would be no need to more 155mm shells.

      And because it’s not doctrine, nobody really wants to build more artillery factories that will sell great now, and get mothballed in 5 years. If Russia steps into NATO territory, those factories will sprout like mushrooms, but it’s simply a bad business decision to do so now.

      https://lemmygrad.ml/comment/3172388

      To say these people lack materialism is quite an understatement, they’re just utterly delusional.

      • Krause [he/him]
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        33
        ·
        1 year ago

        NATO doctrine is to bomb the everloving shit out of someone with massive air superiority

        “NATO doctrine is to win”, lmao

        • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆OP
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          32
          ·
          1 year ago

          NATO doctrine is to attack small countries that don’t possess modern weapons or air defence, so yeah technically that’s a true statement.

        • Mzuark
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          1
          ·
          1 year ago

          Remember; these people think killing a population until nothing is left is how you win.

      • ShimmeringKoi [comrade/them]@hexbear.net
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        29
        ·
        1 year ago

        “We’re not doing the thing that works, because that’s soviet badthink. We’re not going to adapt any industrial capacity towards doing the thing that works, because that’s not how we do things. We’re not going to change the way we do things because that’s not what makes the most money. We are very intelligent and winning the war against the Russian hordes”.

        • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆OP
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          23
          ·
          1 year ago

          It’s pretty funny how it’s basically exact same wunderwaffe mentality the nazis had in WW2, nothing changed

      • PolandIsAStateOfMind
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        27
        ·
        1 year ago

        Ask them about the production ability of planes and weapons for them. 200 F-35 is little below of 1/4th of entire amount ever produced and probably around half of currently operative ones.

        If US actually did that it would be the incredible blunder for them, those losses would left US Air Force crippled for years.

        • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆OP
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          25
          ·
          1 year ago

          I would bet money that US does not have the logistics capability to actually field 200 F35s right now. And I also think that it’s extremely likely that the first time it engages Russian air defences, it’ll go down in flames. There’s a reason US and Israel don’t want to operate them anywhere close to Russian air defences in Syria.

        • huf [he/him]@hexbear.net
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          25
          ·
          1 year ago

          only if the F35 is more dangerous to the enemy than it is to the pilots. which is not clear to me.

          losing half their F35s could actually improve the US air force…

      • SpaceDogs
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        13
        ·
        1 year ago

        Okay, I’m not a military/weapons expert or even an enthusiast but does Russia not have their own air defence which would include aircrafts like the F35? I’m just trying to understand the thought process here. Does Russian air defence just suck or is that an assumption they’re making? On every other front they’re doing well, but air is their weakness? It just seems kind of unlikely, but again, I don’t really know much about this stuff…

        • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆OP
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          17
          arrow-down
          1
          ·
          1 year ago

          In fact, Russia has some of the best air defence around. The west focused on trying to achieve air superiority through stealth during the Cold War, while USSR instead focused on air defence systems. Today, it’s generally acknowledged that Russia has some of the best air defence systems in the world, and many of these don’t have any western equivalents https://missilethreat.csis.org/system_tax/russian-air-defense/

          • SpaceDogs
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            5
            ·
            1 year ago

            So if Russia’s air defence is top notch, what makes F35s so special?

            • PolandIsAStateOfMind
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              11
              ·
              1 year ago

              Liberal brain flatness. F-35 program cost is absolutely astronomical, but when liberal hear of it, the pavlov reaction kicks in, and the only conclusions he can get from that is “wow, if it cost 10 times more than Russian fighter, it is surely 10 times better” instead of what even he knows on a daily basis, that in his corrupted country there is nothing more corrupted than MIC.

              • SpaceDogs
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                9
                ·
                1 year ago

                So it’s the good ol’ “expensive means good” philosophy. Cool. Love how that’s just what people are running with nowadays, seems very stable.

            • 420stalin69@hexbear.net
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              3
              ·
              1 year ago

              It’s been carefully designed by extremely talented engineers to ensure parts are sourced from all major players in the MIC.

        • ShimmeringKoi [comrade/them]@hexbear.net
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          13
          ·
          edit-2
          1 year ago

          By all accounts, the RF’s air defense network is really fucking good, because they’ve had like 60 years to adapt to the NATO strategy of sending a million bombers to level a place and counting on the enemy being too poor the intercept them.

          Although even then, the Viet Minh sometimes managed to shoot down US planes just with massed rifle fire

          • SpaceDogs
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            8
            ·
            1 year ago

            Well it’s nice to know that its the exact opposite of what is being stated. You’d think if it was that easy they’d send planes over by now but clearly that wouldn’t bode well for NATO…

            • ShimmeringKoi [comrade/them]@hexbear.net
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              7
              ·
              edit-2
              1 year ago

              I personally think that’s why Ukraine hasn’t been given F35s, because the US knows it would be a pr disaster for it’s highly publicized, peer combat-untested 80 million dollar wunderwaffe to eat an S-3000 missile that ‘only’ cost a million to make.

              • olgas_husband
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                2
                ·
                1 year ago

                also, if russian federation could salvage it and study more efficient ways to combat then, so us would be forced to retrofit lots of units

        • DamarcusArt
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          4
          arrow-down
          1
          ·
          1 year ago

          A big part of the lib’s understanding of the world is built upon the idea that they are the “clever hero” who will come up with a brilliant strategy that their enemy will never see coming. This is the baseline, regardless of how “brilliant” their idea actually is. So if their idea is “what if planes?” Then the bad guy will never suspect they would ever use a vehicle that has been used in wars for over a century, and will be completely blindsided by the brilliance of NATO bombers. Russian air defence is literally a non-factor in their armchair generalling.

      • angrytoadnoises
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        12
        ·
        1 year ago

        christ the way these people speak is how a warmonger in civilization vi speaks

      • Mzuark
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        4
        ·
        1 year ago

        Because lobbing shells at eachother is Soviet doctrine, not NATO. NATO doctrine is to bomb the everloving shit out of someone with massive air superiority. If NATO decided to send 200 F35s to Ukraine, there would be no need to more 155mm shells.

        First of all, it is hilarious that they think bombing the shit out of someone is something the good guy does. Secondly, they really just don’t comprehend that Russia can just shoot back if that happens.

        • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆OP
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          6
          arrow-down
          1
          ·
          1 year ago

          The whole proxy war was basically premised on the idea that Russian military would immediately crumble when faced with superior western technology.

  • DamarcusArt
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    41
    arrow-down
    2
    ·
    edit-2
    1 year ago

    I really wish the world the liberals invented was reality. A world of simplistic good vs evil, a world where the “hard working” prosper and the people suffering actually deserve it. Their fictional world is borderline utopic in a sense. I guess that’s why they fight so hard against reality. They’re insistent that if they just believe in utopia enough, it will manifest all on its own.

    • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆OP
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      24
      ·
      1 year ago

      It’s such an infantile world view, it’s like these people just never matured intellectually to be able to comprehend that the world isn’t just black and white.

  • loathsome dongeaterA
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    39
    arrow-down
    1
    ·
    1 year ago

    The liberal baby-brain is able to grapple with only one thing at a time. Now that they are critical of the war from the point of view of vulgar pacifism, you get reductive answers like “arms dealers” which completely disregards the Western self-imposed imperative to pressure and balkanise Russia. Not even gonna mention the racist epithets being tossed around willy nilly there lmao.

  • olgas_husband
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    35
    ·
    1 year ago

    as a comrade said, zelensky should by now move to miami and create little ukraine and make a thematic park where people pay big bucks to emulate the invansion of russia and putin assassination. not only he would get out alive, also very rich

    • Tankiedesantski [he/him]@hexbear.net
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      28
      ·
      1 year ago

      I think he’s currently scoping out his own usefulness as a Dalai Lama type leader in exile. Otherwise there’s really no point in him cancelling elections.

      • olgas_husband
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        26
        arrow-down
        1
        ·
        1 year ago

        i stand with my point about the theme park, zelensky would live as sort of mickey mouse for fascists

        as for he could’ve argue and stand ground that elections aren’t possible because the country is at war, but he said the quiet part out loud that wouldn’t do elections because certain conditions were not met, meaning he would lose.

        i think he is scoping out his own live by continuing this war, he will either get disposed by nato or by his opposition in the country

        • DamarcusArt
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          3
          arrow-down
          1
          ·
          1 year ago

          I think he would live in perpetual fear that if he fled, neo-nazis would view this as him “betraying the cause” and would try to kill him. That’s the only reason I can think of for why he hasn’t fled yet.

    • SpaceDogs
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      7
      ·
      1 year ago

      Speaking of “little Ukraine” we actually have something like where I’m at, sort of (not in my exact location but near by). I’ve visited it before, it’s like a historic site thing where you walk through different time periods and people in costumes pretend like they’re from there.

  • ghost_of_faso2
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    29
    ·
    1 year ago

    Someone in the thread reccomended Timothy Snyder as a source

    Even wikipedia cant hide how much of a hack this guy is;

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Earth_(book)

    Critical reception

    The book began to excite controversy as soon as it was published.[1] It received a mixed review by historian Richard J. Evans in The Guardian.[3] Political commentator Helen Andrews writing in First Things gave it a mostly negative review.[4]

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timothy_Snyder#Bloodlands

    Omer Bartov wrote that “the book presents no new evidence and makes no new arguments”,[28] and in a highly critical review Richard Evans wrote that, because of its lack of causal argument, “Snyder’s book is of no use”, and that Snyder “hasn’t really mastered the voluminous literature on Hitler’s Germany”, which “leads him into error in a number of places” regarding the politics of Nazi Germany

  • Satanic_Mills [comrade/them]@hexbear.net
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    29
    arrow-down
    1
    ·
    1 year ago

    Ukraine is slaughtering the meat waves of Russian hordes 20:1 for every meter they take, we only need more funding to secure their collapse!

    Racism, Enemy-at-the-gates historiography & BluMAGA style ‘trust the plan’ all rolled into one.

  • supersolid_snake
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    26
    ·
    1 year ago

    Liberals will never catch up to reality or morality. We don’t have time for them to do that because they will always be too slow for the current conflict or genocide to have any impact. We have to move past them. They will never be on the same page. There is no amount of informing them or appealing to their humanity that will work.

  • big_spoon
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    22
    arrow-down
    1
    ·
    1 year ago

    no one is “winning” truly in that war imo, but we can infer that russia has the advantage, given that US is too busy with shilling israel to not losing the only place in far east that don’t see america as an mortal enemy

  • ButtigiegMineralMap
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    13
    ·
    1 year ago

    Geopolitical Economic Report (formerly Multipolarista) has a great new report on how the USA meddled in early 2022 to put an end to a Peace Deal. Russia supported it and it got tanked by US meddlersdiplomats