Original message: GenZedong users and moderators warned the Lemmygrad administration of chauvinists and people who harassed other users creating a community called Dongistan. Admins from both Discord and Telegram warned us of these reactionary elements and they were preemptively removed from the community

EDIT: We were working on the assumption that they were PatSocs, because that was the information given to us, and we decided to act upon that without further evidence. It was a mistake on our part. The community was therefore restored, but we are investigating the case further.

We are banning trolls which were harassing admins and other members inside Lemmygrad, and we’ve found out that they are a part of a group called “Horde’s People’s Republic of Dongistan” on Telegram.

    • Catradora-Stalinism☭
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      72 years ago

      wait, they thought you were patsoc because you were pan-arabist?

      huh?

      one question, ba’athism is pan-arabist right?

  • Dunwich
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    172 years ago

    Where is the evidence that any of the people in that community were “patsocs”? Or are you just acting on pure hearsay?

    • Siri Sirius Serious
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      2 years ago

      One east Asian member said “I’m a mongoloid” in on context therefore all are north American patsoc haz fans, therefore ban most active members of telegram gzd general chat in matter or few minutes. There is the evidence about one member, that’s enough.

  • @glaukonome
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    152 years ago

    could you please explain the discord admin thing? as far as i know, it’s all been pretty self-contained on telegram.

    • Camarada ForteOPMA
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      12 years ago

      You mean these trolls are self-contained on Telegram?

      They really aren’t. For the record, when I mention “these trolls”, I refer to the mods of that community, most people there are fine. But some mods there are disgusting, and they act very reactionary in the name of “irony”. Even some of their mods recognize the troll mods act in a disgusting manner

      • @workingtechnocrat
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        42 years ago

        we banned people for constantly defending pedophilia and feeling the need to post essays concerning how the “anti-sex maoism” thing is a meme… how about you post the whole logs if you’re so confident about this shit being “reactionary”

        • Camarada ForteOPMA
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          02 years ago

          I should be clear that I am not trying to portray your whole community as a reactionary cesspool. I in fact was clear of that in the comment you replied to,

          For the record, when I mention “these trolls”, I refer to the mods of that community, most people there are fine. But some mods there are disgusting, and they act very reactionary in the name of “irony”.

          The fact that you have (or had?) moderators promoting pretty shady stuff, in a position of influence and authority, is what concerned me.

          You should also know that, even though in your conversations some of you have talked negatively about me and my personal life the day I posted about removing your community, I agreed to reinstate your community in Lemmygrad. And both the decision to remove and reinstate your community was a collective one, and no individual admin should bare full responsibility for it, I was only the one who posted it here.

      • @glaukonome
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        22 years ago

        i don’t think your use of decontextualised screenshots is fair, and i don’t think it paints an accurate picture of what the chat is like. if you are actually interested in properly chairing this people’s court, i’d like to ask that whoever is providing you these also posts the discussion around them. both the post regarding the creation of the socialistsmemes community and especially the posts suggesting a raid on genzedong were adamantly opposed by almost everyone else - mods included, as i was one at the time.

        ideally i’d also like to, you know, talk to whoever’s surveilling us - in full confidence outside of both the dongistan chat and lemmygrad - but i don’t hold out much hope for that i guess. i would like them to know that it’s actually been pretty upsetting for some people in the chat to have the possibility of their posts being shared to hostile people outside the group, because at less than 100 people we’re pretty tight-knit and some of us have shared things which are quite personal. i don’t personally care how this tiny online group where we post jokes about anti-sex maoism and make fun of each other’s tastes in food comes across on here, but it is uncomfortable to realise that something you’ve posted among friends may well be screenshotted, decontextualised and posted on a random discord server or wherever so that people you’ve never interacted with can gossip about how you’re all awful people.

        • Camarada ForteOPMA
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          02 years ago

          i don’t personally care how this tiny online group where we post jokes about anti-sex maoism and make fun of each other’s tastes in food comes across on here, but it is uncomfortable to realise that something you’ve posted among friends may well be screenshotted, decontextualised and posted on a random discord server or wherever so that people you’ve never interacted with can gossip about how you’re all awful people.

          I understand your concern. I personally asked them to not share with me more screenshots, because I honestly got tired. Of course I shouldn’t reveal the identity of the people who sent me the screenshots because last we talked they wished to remain in the group, but as far as I could tell, they enjoyed the community, but were bothered by the behavior of a few moderators there. It was not a single person who sent me them.

          I should note that no context justifies some of the stuff I was sent, whether it is public or “among friends”, whether it was truly meant or “ironic”. It’s our duty to criticize reactionary tendencies among our friends, and by being silent we are just being complicit. But in respect to the privacy of your group, I will refrain from posting these screenshots further, and stick to moderating inside Lemmygrad only.

  • @panic
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    132 years ago

    Rule 4: you’re only allowed a maximum of 45 minutes browsing and participating in Lemmygrad. After that you’ll be logged off by any means necessary and forced to touch grass.

    • AzovSlayer
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      122 years ago

      It’s absurd even thinking that after reading like more than 5 messages of us (something a certain power hungry 17 yo WHITE girl wouldn’t do). But when you haven’t visited the community in like 2 months nor have you done your job of being an admin, of course that’d happen.

  • @Satanael
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    2 years ago

    How exactly were they harassing others? I’ve been on the Telegram for quite some time and have interacted with mods such as Andassol and I never saw anything to suggest there was serious harassment. Could you give an example with evidence?

    • Camarada ForteOPMA
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      2 years ago

      Sure.

      Some members of the group you are in (Horde’s People’s Republic of Dongistan) were planning to harass Grace, which is a moderator of the GZD community, and they actually did harass her. Then after the crackdown on the trolls from your group infested in Lemmygrad, they kept spamming the Lemmygrad admins and harassing us in general. The mods of HPRD even advocated sending the invite link to the GZD Telegram group to anti-communists just to harass the mods there:

      While the shit you post in your group is weird and sometimes disgusting, I reckon it’s just a few mods who are troubling, most of you are okay, although your choice of associating yourself with them I can’t honestly comprehend, your Telegram group is infested with reactionary stuff.

      I personally disagree with Grace’s moderation style, and her banning of dozens of people because she disagree with their views on Pan-Arabism and Ba’athism. This is a style of moderation that Lemmygrad admins do not advocate, and in fact, fight against it. However, none of that justifies harassing other people, and even compromising a whole community because of your personal issues with someone.

      • @Satanael
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        22 years ago

        If this is your only evidence of harassment and you are not willing to show more, then you have no real case.

        • Camarada ForteOPMA
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          12 years ago

          This is not evidence of harassment, this is evidence of the reactionary tendencies of some moderators. The reactionary mods, some of which harassed us, were already banned, which were Dunwich, AzovSlayer and Siri Sirius Serious.

      • @Satanael
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        22 years ago

        Satanael What you didn’t see in that conversation was that we agreed to not do it precisely because of how shitty it was. I was there and specifically said we shouldn’t do it. If thinking of harassment and not actually doing it now qualifies as harassment then I don’t know what is real harassment. BTW, I am a mod there too and actively try to tone down the community when I can.

        • Camarada ForteOPMA
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          2 years ago

          What you didn’t see in that conversation was that we agreed to not do it precisely because of how shitty it was.

          I know that you eventually disagreed, but the point of these screenshots is to show that in numerous instances it was discussed ways to particularly harass the mods of GZD. In the comment, I do not say the plans shown had been done, I say they were discussed.

          But that GZD mods and even admins of Lemmygrad were harassed, we basically saw it from our own experience, because our inboxes got spammed during the whole confusion, and we banned those who did such actions against us. I shared these screenshots not to show evidence of harassment, but to show evidence of the reactionary tendencies of some of its moderators.

          I am thankful that this community at least has someone to tone it down, because it often got off limits, stuff that would get anyone banned here. Last time I checked, they banned one moderator for also toning it down (ajegy), so at least I hope you last.

  • @zhou_kim
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    2 years ago

    They weren’t patsocs nor reactionary though, afaik they have only used the Mongoloid joke (and ironically, has to be said), which, tbh, is funny (though if the admins don’t want that joke to be used, shouldn’t they have just warned and not outright ban?)

      • Free PalestineA
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        62 years ago

        Your comment was removed unfairly. You didn’t break any of our rules with your comment, so I’ve restored it.

        Though I will ask and warn that there be no “mongoloid jokes” on lemmygrad, that can be a bannable offence.

    • @glaukonome
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      92 years ago

      protracted people’s war against touching grass

    • MarxStuff
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      72 years ago

      i don’t know much but apparently there was some drama regarding the owner of the genzedong telegram, and they banned all pan-arabists? and now the banned guys are trying to make their new community here, but they keep getting banned because the gzd telegram owner told the lemmygrad admins that they were patsocs? this is all i know so i may be wrong.

      • Muad'DibberA
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        2 years ago

        We’ve re-instated that community, as we don’t ban pan-arabists or ba’athism, and the patsoc accusation was given without sufficient evidence. However a few of their users have been harassing admins, so have been banned as a result. I don’t think that applies to every member of that community tho.

        As always comrades, abide by rule 3: be respectful to others.

        • MarxStuff
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          52 years ago

          alright, thanks for clearing that up!

  • DankZedong A
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    82 years ago

    Reading all these comments and I still don’t get what’s going on lol. Was Dongistan really that bad? I didn’t really understand the posts but nothing struck me as offensive or something.

    • Dunwich
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      92 years ago

      Here’s the crux of the matter: a bunch of us got into an argument with Grace (head admin of genzedong) in the telegram group over pan-arabism (which she denounced as ‘reactionary’) and a lot of people disagreed so she decided to purge everyone who argued with her on the topic a few days later (including many other people who didn’t even participate in the convo but were associated with us nonetheless). So we decided to form our own community and do our own thing.

      Unfortunately, it seems that grace and her friend zoe have been spreading lies about us to the lemmy admins and had us banned based purely on their own personal resentment towards us (the ‘patsoc’ accusation is a baseless smear, some members liked to meme about the wow_mao mongolian video and that’s literally it, accusing us of being ‘patsocs’ is simply the excuse they’re using to get us banned everywhere when the real reason is that they have personal grievances against us)

      • Muad'DibberA
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        142 years ago

        Okay, it seems we were working off of false info. I’ll restore the community and unban the one user for now. (and make another post)

        For the record, we do not ban pan-arabism or bath’ism, and the only sectarian ban rule we have so far is no patsocs allowed.

      • DankZedong A
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        122 years ago

        Is this the leftist infighting everyone told me about???

        That makes things more clear, thanks.

        • @Rafael_Luisi
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          62 years ago

          Leftist unity? More like leftist disunity lmao

      • Muad'DibberA
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        2 years ago

        Okay new evidence: you were trolling lemmygrad, and for that you’ve earned a site ban.

        Also what the hell is “mongoloid people’s republic”, sounds incredibly racist.

        • @glaukonome
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          82 years ago

          mongoloid people’s republic is a reference to the wow_mao video - most of the active users are ourselves asian or slavic and so we jokingly call ourselves that. it’s also the only place online where i’ve ever been 100% comfortable with people knowing my ethnicity, and i know other people feel the same way.

          also, i’m not sure why someone calling the people’s court a larp is proof of trolling? i think people should be allowed to have criticisms of lemmygrad.

          • Camarada ForteOPMA
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            2 years ago

            If they call the whole site a LARP, insulting us and the community, they show they have no interest in respecting others, and in participating in a comradely manner. This is not merely a criticism, this is an insult, and a word like criticism shouldn’t be wasted by a superficial comment like this.

            I understand most people associated with the then called “Mongoloid People’s Republic” is not a reactionary troll, but most of the admins there such as Dunwich, Akim Zhurba Zhurba, Siri Sirus Serious and AzovSlayer all act like trolls.

            Don’t worry, we won’t ban those who uphold Ba’athism, Pan-Arabism, we only ban trolls and those who harass others.

            • @glaukonome
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              02 years ago

              i have to admit, it is somewhat ironic coming back to this comment after reading this:

              They are simply reactionary trolls with very concerning psychological issues. My advice to them would be to go to therapy, but I feel like they’ve already lost their sense of self by shitposting as a defense mechanism from their own issues.

              is this not reactionary (as all ableism is), disrespectful and uncomradely? even if you don’t feel particularly comradely towards the horde, i’m sure you are aware that there are people who are affected by mental health issues who are reading this. your post is an insult quite a bit more cruel than someone calling this community a larp.

              • Camarada ForteOPMA
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                02 years ago

                i’m sure you are aware that there are people who are affected by mental health issues who are reading this.

                I am absolutely aware of that, hence why I gave the advice of therapy, in sincere good faith. I uphold the idea that everyone benefits from therapy, and I wrote that the reactionary trolls inside your community would benefit from therapy honestly from a place of concern.

                I’ve seen the reactionary stuff posted inside your community, and while I am frankly disgusted by its content, I do not blame those who post it, I see them as victims of the reactionary ideology present in bourgeois society. We are all reflections of the contradictions of our society, and even I may inadvertently reproduce reactionary ideology without realizing it. But my comment is not ableist, and I didn’t mean to advice therapy as an insult, because I myself went to therapy for over an year and I benefited much from it.

          • Muad'DibberA
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            12 years ago

            They called lemmygrad a larp, clearly not someone who has an interest in healthy engagement here.

            • @glaukonome
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              62 years ago

              why does a comment someone makes on a different website unaffiliated with lemmygrad warrant a complete ban from lemmygrad? i don’t think that would necessarily indicate what her behaviour would be like on here. i think many people make off-hand critical comments about the websites they use while still being able to use them in normal and respectful ways.

              • Muad'DibberA
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                12 years ago

                They called this site a larp, what’s preventing them from using another site?

                • @glaukonome
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                  52 years ago

                  i appreciate that you found the comment hurtful, but why does that warrant a ban without warning? i would understand if she was advocating for a brigade or something, but i don’t think that’s what’s going on here.

              • Camarada ForteOPMA
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                2 years ago

                why does a comment someone makes on a different website unaffiliated with lemmygrad warrant a complete ban from lemmygrad?

                If they’re insulting our community, then it doesn’t matter if it’s inside or outside Lemmygrad, they are still responsible for what they say. If behind our backs this is what they have to say about us, why should we let them here? Their messages just show they are not interested in healthy engagement with others, they are just interested trolling and in general being disrespectful.

            • Siri Sirius Serious
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              32 years ago

              People are legitimatly frustrated, but you don’t want to read my text walls…

          • Muad'DibberA
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            2 years ago

            Saying “lol lemmygrad is such a larp”, is clearly someone who isn’t here in good faith. They can join another platform that suits them better.

              • Muad'DibberA
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                -22 years ago

                Why don’t they just join a site they don’t think is a larp then? What’s preventing them from doing that?

      • @ThatCakeThough
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        12 years ago

        I sure wish that energy could’ve been used offline.

  • @Inbrededcanadian
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    72 years ago

    My morbid curiosity is kicking in again, how reactionary are they?

      • @PolandIsAStateOfMind
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        -12 years ago

        Quick question, is it bannable too like in the certain murican hivemind places, to say that patriotism have class characteristics?

    • Camarada ForteOPMA
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      2 years ago

      They were described as followers of Haz/InfraRed, a Twitch streamer and YouTuber associated with “North-American nationalism” (patsoc). Their Dongistan community was very strange and very troll-like, with no meaningful content, in a vibe similar to post-ironic 4chan memes

      • @Darkerseid
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        132 years ago

        People on GZD telegram make fun of Haz/Infrared because they are patsocs. It is a joke taken out of context by admins. Most of the people who got banned were never given a reason (patsoc irony is just one). This whole situation is completely misguided and gross abuse of power.

      • Siri Sirius Serious
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        2 years ago

        OYes because it didn’t been in Lemmygrad long enough. One East Asian comrade called herself a mongoloid because of racism in North America, and teenage admin banned her for being Haz fan. I think majority of dongistan community never heard for Haz, don’t spend time on “marxist” YouTubers… Also being mongoloid is related to Russians being called orcs and horde, with similar thesis as Hitler that “they ain’t pure whites, they are mixed with mongoloids”, I don’t know how you can be patsoc North American saying that if you ain’t from North America. 2nd issue was panarabism, calling Nasser and Assad fans, or just people that like idea of unified arab world because it would change balance of power in that region (regardless of race or faith, culture, it meant to include arab speaking countries, even though some had other languages used inside its community besides that, and arabic itself is not standard Arabic but have many dialacets, so that makes it “cultural genocide” if people choose to speak 普通话 alike language more then regional one). Admin never heard for baath split, assumed that cia-Israel paid Sadam Husein is one and only “pan arabist” (he was just Iraq baath party leader, nothing much panarabist there), even though Assad and Hoshni Mubarak sent their troops in Iraq agaisnt Sadam during Gulf War. Even though Syria during Assads was multi ethnic and multi seceterian /religious, while after civil war many freedom fighters (like isis and ypg your admins adore probably) many targeted, displaced, killed people because they differ. She was told all this, but emotional teenager that is all about having opinion and being right, and not knowing much about the subject (I guess because there is no marxist YouTuber talking about it, that’s starting and ending point of all marxism resources) was blind for arguments and banned everyone that defended that stance, she shared me text about “arab nationalism” as argument, page and a half long, arab nationalism in Ottoman empire… Dongistan members including me defending panarabism from being called genocidal, told her that idea is union of Arab speaking world, not exlusion of non Arabs, non sunnis inside that state. Also many of those members including me ain’t arab, neither they come from Muslim community, so idk how that can make us patsoc? Dongistan have reading club, and we had discussion about Edward Said - Orientalism, maybe that would teach your YouTuber banhammer admin about colonial legacy in middle East rather then YouTubers. Sub didn’t even lasted for 2 days, so no one could see its opinions rather then sharing memes they made about whole situation (she said something about Lybian Baath party? and thought all panarabists are Saddam supporters which is pretty rare, and nobody in dongistan supports Saddam, while there is unironic Saddam adoring sub here, even thought there is nothing socialist about it). Nobody mocks teenagers from being emotional and doing stuff like that, problem is whole ml community depends on emotional communist aisthetic driven “communist” will. Aisthetization of politics and miltiary is truly fascist supporter thing to do, that’s how Mussolini and Hitler gain popular support. Reason for a ban was “trolling GZD admins”, which really was true, but isn’t this Lemmygrad and should have rules autonomous from r/GZD sub on reddit ? Should we depend on feelings of young lady feeling ashamed when someone mocks her for being wrong and banning all around because of that (she banned whole group for some other reason, all telegram gzd general chat most active users are arbitrarly banned/kicked with given no reason for that in matter of minutes, so maybe idea was to change opinions in discussion that never stopped by changing top active users, maybe she disliked discussion there, it wasn’t American enough or something idk. Gzd general chat is dead now regarding activity).

        • Catradora-Stalinism☭
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          82 years ago

          ummm, I don’t disagree or anything, but can you just format a bit (if thats okay), the text wall terrifies me

        • Camarada ForteOPMA
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          32 years ago

          Thanks for the wall of text. It’s a good thing you at least acknowledge you were trolling GZD mods.

          For the record, this is the type of thing this user posts in their Telegram chat:

      • @TheAnonymouseJoker
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        12 years ago

        TIL what is PatSoc, can you elaborate on who Caleb Maupin actually is, since he is a PatSoc? I once made a post of his podcast with Nathan Rich, and it got removed, and I know jackshit about this to date.

      • @jamabalayaman
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        -42 years ago

        Yikes - anything that’s like 4chan is ultra cringe…

          • @jamabalayaman
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            32 years ago

            Outright banning is a little harsh lol, but I’d defs discourge that stuff due to it’s origin. Wojack can stay I guess, but the virgin and chad thing comes directly from the incel community - that’s incredibly cringe. Besides, why can’t we create our own memes? Just reappropriating memes from literally the most reactionary sources only prepetuates that whole idea that “the left can’t meme”…