This article is about how the US and Canada are shifting the blame for the boarding schools that killed thousands of natives for generations and the forced assimilation of those people… but yes, be upset that the title alludes to DNA I guess.
It’s real easy to find the author’s use of the term “DNA” in the title upsetting, when you’re not in the hundreds of indigenous groups who’ve been forced into generations of oppression at the hands of Anglos. It’s a provocative title, it’s meant to catch your eye. Now actually read the article, and understand that it’s pulling attention to the treatment of indigenous people by Anglo governments. Treatment that Anglo governments are currently trying to deny while claiming the boarding schools for the Uyghur are the same thing.
Really think the title of the article is a problem? tell that to the Beothuk people of New Foundland, who were wiped out by settlers - it was a genocide.
Tell it to the Koroa of Mississippi, who died from European diseases and assimilated into the stronger nearby tribes to escape the English settlers.
Tell it to the Westo of the South East, who were killed off by war with the Carolinian settlers.
Or to any of the various tribes history forgot, because the murderous Anglos didn’t deem it important enough to catalogue them. Tell it to the millions of Africans who were enslaved by the Anglos in West Africa and sailed into the Americas to act as a labour force. Tell it to the Palestinians who are actively being killed off by the Anglo Backed Israeli government.
There is a long and tragic history of white people, particularly anglo-saxons, violating the sovereignty of nations, raping, murdering, and profiteering. To say it’s in the DNA, this is true in a figurative sense. But what does this wording really accomplish? When open to interpretation, these statements agitate reactionaries and make it harder to educate. It’s just unconstructive.
Edit: Please notice I did not say to educate reactionaries. That’s not what I mean at all.
The Chinese author of this article doesn’t care about educating American reactionaries, they care about setting the record straight. What they care about, and is the point of the article, is far more important than radicalizing the very few American reactionaries who would actually read the Chinese backed source.
It’s far better to assert that the Anglo governments are being hypocritical on Xinjiang and the treatment of Uyghur, while themselves trying to cover up a long history of genocide, than it is to pick and choose words for maximum effect of educating reactionaries.
A Chinese author is pointing out the long history of Anglo oppression, that also happened to touch China and is currently a factor in PRC - HK relations, and y’all are too busy being upset that they put “embedded in [their] DNA” in the title of the article.
I don’t care about educating American reactionaries either. Notice I didn’t say “to educate reactionaries” or even “to educate Americans”
But you see firsthand how even in a forum full of communists how incredibly successful this statement is at distracting from the main point. You’ve observed this yourself. So you must see where I’m coming from.
Juxtaposing the West’s allegations about Uyghurs with their past and present treatment of indigenous peoples is honestly a powerful way of exposing the contradictions in these states, and showing people that the media and government of these countries are clearly not on the side of oppressed peoples, so these allegations do not come from a place of concern, so they must come from some other motive. This approach has been very effective so far, so I want it to be emphasized as much as possible.
Having just re read the autobiography of malcolm x, I think there is some value in making provocative statements like that. Mainly, it acts as good bait that exposes the superiority complex of people who identify as that group, and forces them into either a defense (along racial lines), or an honest appraisal of their history. The only people getting offended by those statements, are not ppl likely to join the side of the oppressed anyway, because the emotional basis for their beliefs is still some form of white supremacy, however diluted that may be.
Also its an understandable reaction from oppressed groups who have been told from cradle to grave, in media and culture, that they’re inferior to whites, and that the only way to be successful, is to emulate whites, the way they talk, dress, etc.
For some context, the hot topic in the US right now is critical race theory and the response from the right so far has been to ban it from education and to misrepresent it. The straw man they use is that CRT is actually race realism against white people. They’ve chosen this approach because they think it will be useful for deflecting the guilt of their own racism onto others and obfuscating the reasoning for the ban.
Now most people are not fooled by this, because it is moronic. But saying Anglo-Saxons are genetically predisposed to violence leans right into this straw man, and the left defending it would make it more believable to people. I don’t see how such a statement leads people to an “honest appraisal of their history.” In my experience, people are much more likely to discount everything you say beyond that point.
Since you read the autobiography of Malcolm X, you know that in one case he regretted telling a woman there was nothing she, a white woman, could do that would help their cause. I agree on the point of provocative statements, but not every provocative statement is useful just because it is provocative.
On the second paragraph I fully agree.
so now I’m just someone biting a “bait”, with a “superiority complex”, someone “not likely to join the side of the oppressed”, and having “the emotional basis of my beliefs” being “white supermacy”. at least you considered an alternative, someone
who have been told from cradle to grave, in media and culture, that they’re inferior to whites, and that the only way to be successful, is to emulate whites, the way they talk, dress, etc.
which I can’t tell if is better or worse.
not to mention the one calling me a reactionary or suggesting I don’t understand the pain of indigenous people. all that because I rightfully called out a genuinely racist title? you people are so fucking cruel.
a few days ago there was a thread on lemmy.ml and we all blamed sinophobes for their bigotry, but when it’s reversed it’s ok? we said dismissing an open source CPU for being Chinese is bigotry, and it’s not an acceptable excuse that “they mean the communist party would put backdoors in it”. but now “white people are genetically berutal against indigenous people” is a delicate metaphor? don’t be so biased. racism is wrong, no matter the race.
edit: this reminds of a thread on lemmygrad a while back, when I explained why tiktok might even be worse than instagram or youtube (its addictive aspects) and how it can be even more harmful (by lowering the attention span to 15 seconds of esily digestable videos), but apparantly lemmygrad users believed being Chinese makes it ok somehow? like have some consistency guys.
a few days ago there was a thread on lemmy.ml and we all blamed sinophobes for their bigotry, but when it’s reversed it’s ok?
White isn’t a race, its a social construct that has come for historical reasons to stand for a group of European colonialists from a variety of countries. I’d tread very carefully if I were you, because we will not tolerate white supremacists whining about “reverse racism” here.
White isn’t a race, its a social construct that has come for historical reasons to stand for a group of European colonialists from a variety of countries.
I never said white is a race either. I didn’t even mention white. we were talking about Anglo-Saxons I assume? even then I clarified in one of my comments that Anglo-Saxons aren’t technically a race.
I’d tread very carefully if I were you
and now I’m getting ban threats from an admin of lemmygrad because we disagree over a title. why are you so hostile? did I say anything outrageous without knowing? I apoligoze if I did, but can you point to it?
white supremacists whining about “reverse racism” here.
bold claim. I never suggested, or even implied that white people are superior or any bullshit like that. as I said I didn’t even mention white, you brought it up. I just said saying that an ethnic group has a negative trait in their DNA is racist. but apparantly it’s a controversial take on lemmygrad.ml
and you would do me a favour if you don’t classify me in the “reverse racism” crowd. I did not say there’s sytematic racism against “white people”, I didn’t even come close to that. it was just a title.
but well, thanks for your warning, and for not banning me. I enjoy talking to you guys, just wished you would reply to me and explain why I’m wrong, instead of downvoting me. that would make a more productive discussion, and a more pleasant experience.
I think it’s pretty clear that DNA is just a symbolic term for “culture” or a similar concept, things that are NOT set in stone like DNA and can absolutely be changed with enough will. There isn’t an oppression gene and the article does not insinuate that anyone is “born” an oppressor but they ARE born into a society that without change, will turn them into oppressors.
The article is also very good, provocative title aside. Canadian and US politicians, and pretty much every article from the BBC or NYT have brought out every orientalist trope they can think of, and accused chinese ppl of having ingrained negative traits. Seems strange that many people are coming to defend the orientalists.
Hate to have to say it, especially on Lemmygrad where I really hoped it wouldn’t need to be said… but I guess because this is a website that’s mostly used in the Anglo-sphere it makes sense.
White people gonna do white people things. My grandfather’s hatred for the English in Ireland prepared me to critically support the cries of the oppressed like this, but it seems some people here either don’t have echos of oppression in their bloodline, or are too far removed from it to know how to hone in on what’s important when non-whites call out whites. This issue is very common on the western left when Non-Cis-Hetero-Whites try to use provocative speech to pull attention to the systematic oppression that benefits Cis-Hetero-Whites.
People who are reading these comments and thinking “how dare this Chinese author say white people are bad” should probably put down the phone/computer for a few minutes and read theorists of colour and self-reflect on why your position isn’t the right one. This, that some of y’all are doing, is the tone policing of the white moderate. Leave that shit on reddit.
ah, it’s just getting worse. we’re on the same side (at least regarding this issue), yet we can’t agree on such a simple thing.
This article is about how the US and Canada are shifting the blame for the boarding schools that killed thousands of natives for generations and the forced assimilation of those people.
I whole-heartedly agree that this subject needs more attention. what has happened is beyond anything I can describe, and it hasn’t even happened long ago, so the “it was previous generations” excuse doesn’t work. it’s hard evidence that the government and church are corrupted as hell, and don’t deserve their position.
be upset that the title alludes to DNA I guess.
It’s real easy to find the author’s use of the term “DNA” in the title upsetting when you’re not in the hundreds of indigenous groups who’ve been forced into generations of oppression at the hands of Anglos.
how is this relevant? and how does it justify the title?
It’s a provocative title, it’s meant to catch your eye.
it doesn’t make it ok, making racist statements to get our attention to an important thing is still wrong. I would also add that if the author’s intentionwas to highlight the crime commited by North American countries, they’re failing miserably, all we’re talking about is the title and if it’s racist or not.
Now actually read the article
I agree with the content of the article.
and understand that it’s pulling attention to the treatment of indigenous people by Anglo governments.
a noble goal, but as I mentioned, it seems that they’re not achieving their goal by that title.
Treatment that Anglo governments are currently trying to deny while claiming the boarding schools for the Uyghur are the same thing.
I agree, they’re not in a position to lecture the world about human rights. also in my opinion, the claims that “millions of Uyghurs are held in concentration camps against their will, it’s a genocide!” are utter bullshit. this article could be a great opportunity to show that these countries aren’t concerned about human rights, but all it’s accomplished is making us argue about its title.
I don’t know what you want to achieve with the rest of your comment. but let’s see your reaction if we change the title to be about another race. if someone had said “being slaves is the African’s DNA”, wouldn’t you call it out? or would you start defending it by saying “see, DNA means history here, the writer must be trying to make us pay attention the crimes commited against Africans”, “oh no, African isn’t a race, so this is not racism” and “tell it to that tribe killed by those Africans!”, “author is trying to get your attention, it’s justified.”
This article is about how the US and Canada are shifting the blame for the boarding schools that killed thousands of natives for generations and the forced assimilation of those people… but yes, be upset that the title alludes to DNA I guess.
It’s real easy to find the author’s use of the term “DNA” in the title upsetting, when you’re not in the hundreds of indigenous groups who’ve been forced into generations of oppression at the hands of Anglos. It’s a provocative title, it’s meant to catch your eye. Now actually read the article, and understand that it’s pulling attention to the treatment of indigenous people by Anglo governments. Treatment that Anglo governments are currently trying to deny while claiming the boarding schools for the Uyghur are the same thing.
Really think the title of the article is a problem? tell that to the Beothuk people of New Foundland, who were wiped out by settlers - it was a genocide.
Tell it to the Koroa of Mississippi, who died from European diseases and assimilated into the stronger nearby tribes to escape the English settlers.
Tell it to the Westo of the South East, who were killed off by war with the Carolinian settlers.
Or to any of the various tribes history forgot, because the murderous Anglos didn’t deem it important enough to catalogue them. Tell it to the millions of Africans who were enslaved by the Anglos in West Africa and sailed into the Americas to act as a labour force. Tell it to the Palestinians who are actively being killed off by the Anglo Backed Israeli government.
There is a long and tragic history of white people, particularly anglo-saxons, violating the sovereignty of nations, raping, murdering, and profiteering. To say it’s in the DNA, this is true in a figurative sense. But what does this wording really accomplish? When open to interpretation, these statements agitate reactionaries and make it harder to educate. It’s just unconstructive.
Edit: Please notice I did not say to educate reactionaries. That’s not what I mean at all.
The Chinese author of this article doesn’t care about educating American reactionaries, they care about setting the record straight. What they care about, and is the point of the article, is far more important than radicalizing the very few American reactionaries who would actually read the Chinese backed source.
It’s far better to assert that the Anglo governments are being hypocritical on Xinjiang and the treatment of Uyghur, while themselves trying to cover up a long history of genocide, than it is to pick and choose words for maximum effect of educating reactionaries.
A Chinese author is pointing out the long history of Anglo oppression, that also happened to touch China and is currently a factor in PRC - HK relations, and y’all are too busy being upset that they put “embedded in [their] DNA” in the title of the article.
I don’t care about educating American reactionaries either. Notice I didn’t say “to educate reactionaries” or even “to educate Americans”
But you see firsthand how even in a forum full of communists how incredibly successful this statement is at distracting from the main point. You’ve observed this yourself. So you must see where I’m coming from.
Juxtaposing the West’s allegations about Uyghurs with their past and present treatment of indigenous peoples is honestly a powerful way of exposing the contradictions in these states, and showing people that the media and government of these countries are clearly not on the side of oppressed peoples, so these allegations do not come from a place of concern, so they must come from some other motive. This approach has been very effective so far, so I want it to be emphasized as much as possible.
Having just re read the autobiography of malcolm x, I think there is some value in making provocative statements like that. Mainly, it acts as good bait that exposes the superiority complex of people who identify as that group, and forces them into either a defense (along racial lines), or an honest appraisal of their history. The only people getting offended by those statements, are not ppl likely to join the side of the oppressed anyway, because the emotional basis for their beliefs is still some form of white supremacy, however diluted that may be.
Also its an understandable reaction from oppressed groups who have been told from cradle to grave, in media and culture, that they’re inferior to whites, and that the only way to be successful, is to emulate whites, the way they talk, dress, etc.
For some context, the hot topic in the US right now is critical race theory and the response from the right so far has been to ban it from education and to misrepresent it. The straw man they use is that CRT is actually race realism against white people. They’ve chosen this approach because they think it will be useful for deflecting the guilt of their own racism onto others and obfuscating the reasoning for the ban.
Now most people are not fooled by this, because it is moronic. But saying Anglo-Saxons are genetically predisposed to violence leans right into this straw man, and the left defending it would make it more believable to people. I don’t see how such a statement leads people to an “honest appraisal of their history.” In my experience, people are much more likely to discount everything you say beyond that point.
Since you read the autobiography of Malcolm X, you know that in one case he regretted telling a woman there was nothing she, a white woman, could do that would help their cause. I agree on the point of provocative statements, but not every provocative statement is useful just because it is provocative.
On the second paragraph I fully agree.
just saw this comment and now I wanna cry T_T
so now I’m just someone biting a “bait”, with a “superiority complex”, someone “not likely to join the side of the oppressed”, and having “the emotional basis of my beliefs” being “white supermacy”. at least you considered an alternative, someone
which I can’t tell if is better or worse.
not to mention the one calling me a reactionary or suggesting I don’t understand the pain of indigenous people. all that because I rightfully called out a genuinely racist title? you people are so fucking cruel.
a few days ago there was a thread on lemmy.ml and we all blamed sinophobes for their bigotry, but when it’s reversed it’s ok? we said dismissing an open source CPU for being Chinese is bigotry, and it’s not an acceptable excuse that “they mean the communist party would put backdoors in it”. but now “white people are genetically berutal against indigenous people” is a delicate metaphor? don’t be so biased. racism is wrong, no matter the race.
edit: this reminds of a thread on lemmygrad a while back, when I explained why tiktok might even be worse than instagram or youtube (its addictive aspects) and how it can be even more harmful (by lowering the attention span to 15 seconds of esily digestable videos), but apparantly lemmygrad users believed being Chinese makes it ok somehow? like have some consistency guys.
White isn’t a race, its a social construct that has come for historical reasons to stand for a group of European colonialists from a variety of countries. I’d tread very carefully if I were you, because we will not tolerate white supremacists whining about “reverse racism” here.
I never said white is a race either. I didn’t even mention white. we were talking about Anglo-Saxons I assume? even then I clarified in one of my comments that Anglo-Saxons aren’t technically a race.
and now I’m getting ban threats from an admin of lemmygrad because we disagree over a title. why are you so hostile? did I say anything outrageous without knowing? I apoligoze if I did, but can you point to it?
bold claim. I never suggested, or even implied that white people are superior or any bullshit like that. as I said I didn’t even mention white, you brought it up. I just said saying that an ethnic group has a negative trait in their DNA is racist. but apparantly it’s a controversial take on lemmygrad.ml
and you would do me a favour if you don’t classify me in the “reverse racism” crowd. I did not say there’s sytematic racism against “white people”, I didn’t even come close to that. it was just a title.
but well, thanks for your warning, and for not banning me. I enjoy talking to you guys, just wished you would reply to me and explain why I’m wrong, instead of downvoting me. that would make a more productive discussion, and a more pleasant experience.
I think it’s pretty clear that DNA is just a symbolic term for “culture” or a similar concept, things that are NOT set in stone like DNA and can absolutely be changed with enough will. There isn’t an oppression gene and the article does not insinuate that anyone is “born” an oppressor but they ARE born into a society that without change, will turn them into oppressors.
So no, it’s not racist toward Anglo Saxons.
Yeah I find it strange that so many ears perked up at the possibility of racism towards anglo-saxons.
The article is also very good, provocative title aside. Canadian and US politicians, and pretty much every article from the BBC or NYT have brought out every orientalist trope they can think of, and accused chinese ppl of having ingrained negative traits. Seems strange that many people are coming to defend the orientalists.
Western media are definitely guilty of treating cultural and societal issues of Asians like they’re inherited traits that can’t ever change.
Hate to have to say it, especially on Lemmygrad where I really hoped it wouldn’t need to be said… but I guess because this is a website that’s mostly used in the Anglo-sphere it makes sense.
White people gonna do white people things. My grandfather’s hatred for the English in Ireland prepared me to critically support the cries of the oppressed like this, but it seems some people here either don’t have echos of oppression in their bloodline, or are too far removed from it to know how to hone in on what’s important when non-whites call out whites. This issue is very common on the western left when Non-Cis-Hetero-Whites try to use provocative speech to pull attention to the systematic oppression that benefits Cis-Hetero-Whites.
People who are reading these comments and thinking “how dare this Chinese author say white people are bad” should probably put down the phone/computer for a few minutes and read theorists of colour and self-reflect on why your position isn’t the right one. This, that some of y’all are doing, is the tone policing of the white moderate. Leave that shit on reddit.
ah, it’s just getting worse. we’re on the same side (at least regarding this issue), yet we can’t agree on such a simple thing.
I whole-heartedly agree that this subject needs more attention. what has happened is beyond anything I can describe, and it hasn’t even happened long ago, so the “it was previous generations” excuse doesn’t work. it’s hard evidence that the government and church are corrupted as hell, and don’t deserve their position.
how is this relevant? and how does it justify the title?
it doesn’t make it ok, making racist statements to get our attention to an important thing is still wrong. I would also add that if the author’s intentionwas to highlight the crime commited by North American countries, they’re failing miserably, all we’re talking about is the title and if it’s racist or not.
I agree with the content of the article.
a noble goal, but as I mentioned, it seems that they’re not achieving their goal by that title.
I agree, they’re not in a position to lecture the world about human rights. also in my opinion, the claims that “millions of Uyghurs are held in concentration camps against their will, it’s a genocide!” are utter bullshit. this article could be a great opportunity to show that these countries aren’t concerned about human rights, but all it’s accomplished is making us argue about its title.
I don’t know what you want to achieve with the rest of your comment. but let’s see your reaction if we change the title to be about another race. if someone had said “being slaves is the African’s DNA”, wouldn’t you call it out? or would you start defending it by saying “see, DNA means history here, the writer must be trying to make us pay attention the crimes commited against Africans”, “oh no, African isn’t a race, so this is not racism” and “tell it to that tribe killed by those Africans!”, “author is trying to get your attention, it’s justified.”