Because I think cops generally refers to a group of people who are all entirely frontline and if those people continue to be cops after seeing what they do then they have transitioned from being ignorant to being willing participants.
Military personnel signup for a set time and can’t get out of it if they do see or figure out the horror of what they do. The people outside the frontline literally never will physically see it and their ignorance to the fact they’re doing great evil is simply a material demonstration of how weak we are at informing the population at this point in time.
As for your initial question about the bourgeoisie needing to be oppressed, of course, but you’re talking about a proletarian police force now which is a completely different police force to a bourgeoise one. The class character matters.
I don’t think the GS people are idealist enough to get alienated by it, they’re more materialist. They can understand when you explain that “all troops bad” does not have a material effect on the military’s ability to hurt the GS. They get the value in turning them instead of engaging in gesture bullshit with no material effect… At least the ones that you would call comrade do. The general population I simply wouldn’t engage in a conversation with or consider anything to do with troops an area of debate beyond “please stop bombing us and get out of our country”. That has to be targeted at the top though for a material outcome, not the troops themselves.
As for your initial question about the bourgeoisie needing to be oppressed, of course, but you’re talking about a proletarian police force now which is a completely different police force to a bourgeoise one. The class character matters.
Yeah, which was why I said I wanted people to use ‘Which Side Are You On’.
I don’t think the GS people are idealist enough to get alienated by it, they’re more materialist.
Did you not just alienate the person from Mexico (I think?) you were arguing with, along with a bunch of other comrades who downvoted you? I’m referring to those people. Even I, whose family is completely intact btw, am barely tolerating it but that’s cos you’re probably one of my favourite chapo posters. You defended my ancestral homeland, the PRC. You have demonstrated solidarity and so you get a pass. Now, if you were instead one of those Vaush anti-PRC types, I would’ve told you to fuck off this site. I’m sorry, but after all the sinophobic nonsense this year, you’ll forgive me if I’m not particularly charitable to the western left.
Aww you flatter me. I’m just a trans person that refuses to throw them under the bus and understands that we need troops anyway really. Everything I say is built on that foundation so my thought process leans in on personal experiences and really “getting” the hopeless lack of choice situation, I was homeless once and am lucky to be alive now.
I might have upset our GS friend in our interactions but I don’t think it turns them away from continued struggle. I do think throwing trans people under the bus for doing this will make more trans people into contrapoints liberals and I do think failure to be strategic in our messaging with troops will result in never making inroads with them though.
There’s probably no perfect solution here and we have to make a calculation we don’t want to make that is based on what we hope has the best material outcomes towards the goal.
Because I think cops generally refers to a group of people who are all entirely frontline and if those people continue to be cops after seeing what they do then they have transitioned from being ignorant to being willing participants.
Military personnel signup for a set time and can’t get out of it if they do see or figure out the horror of what they do. The people outside the frontline literally never will physically see it and their ignorance to the fact they’re doing great evil is simply a material demonstration of how weak we are at informing the population at this point in time.
As for your initial question about the bourgeoisie needing to be oppressed, of course, but you’re talking about a proletarian police force now which is a completely different police force to a bourgeoise one. The class character matters.
I don’t think the GS people are idealist enough to get alienated by it, they’re more materialist. They can understand when you explain that “all troops bad” does not have a material effect on the military’s ability to hurt the GS. They get the value in turning them instead of engaging in gesture bullshit with no material effect… At least the ones that you would call comrade do. The general population I simply wouldn’t engage in a conversation with or consider anything to do with troops an area of debate beyond “please stop bombing us and get out of our country”. That has to be targeted at the top though for a material outcome, not the troops themselves.
Yeah, which was why I said I wanted people to use ‘Which Side Are You On’.
Did you not just alienate the person from Mexico (I think?) you were arguing with, along with a bunch of other comrades who downvoted you? I’m referring to those people. Even I, whose family is completely intact btw, am barely tolerating it but that’s cos you’re probably one of my favourite chapo posters. You defended my ancestral homeland, the PRC. You have demonstrated solidarity and so you get a pass. Now, if you were instead one of those Vaush anti-PRC types, I would’ve told you to fuck off this site. I’m sorry, but after all the sinophobic nonsense this year, you’ll forgive me if I’m not particularly charitable to the western left.
Aww you flatter me. I’m just a trans person that refuses to throw them under the bus and understands that we need troops anyway really. Everything I say is built on that foundation so my thought process leans in on personal experiences and really “getting” the hopeless lack of choice situation, I was homeless once and am lucky to be alive now.
I might have upset our GS friend in our interactions but I don’t think it turns them away from continued struggle. I do think throwing trans people under the bus for doing this will make more trans people into contrapoints liberals and I do think failure to be strategic in our messaging with troops will result in never making inroads with them though.
There’s probably no perfect solution here and we have to make a calculation we don’t want to make that is based on what we hope has the best material outcomes towards the goal.
Hopefully not. The western left does not have a good track record in staying united.
Haha UK right now… Splitting go brrrrrrrrrrr