Ukraine flag strikes again.

  • @TheAnonymouseJoker
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    2 years ago

    I met a libertarian once who likes Henry George. He told me organ selling and child labour are justified, great things. Recently, in light of Russian operation, he told me NATO is a defensive organisation, and argued Putin must be killed. He also called me a tankie.

    I kept calm for the most part because he is an American teenager.

    • Arsen6331 ☭
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      82 years ago

      I kept calm for the most part because he is an American teenager.

      That’s not much of an excuse. I am a teenager born and living in the US. I am also an ML. Before becoming an ML, I never really thought about ideology, but I was anti-capitalist because I realized before I was even a teenager that the incentive structure of capitalism must lead to misery because it prioritizes capital over everything.

      • @TheAnonymouseJoker
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        42 years ago

        Let us just say you either lucked out, or had natural tendencies towards striving for the greater good and equality since childhood. You probably do not realise what all fell in order for you to reach here.

        • Arsen6331 ☭
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          22 years ago

          You probably do not realise what all fell in order for you to reach here.

          You’re right, that’s probably true

      • @HaSch
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        2 years ago

        There are many factors that have to play together for someone in this environment of misinformation and sensory overload to become an ML. You were anti-capitalist, yes, but only because you were interested in political economics by curiosity or necessity; AND in a position to either reason or experience by force the fact that there is a fundamentally dangerous and unsustainable element to our society; AND that at its core the nature of this element is concrete, material, and economic rather than diffuse, metaphysical and cultural-political.

        Then you became a communist by realising that this element is an inextricable part of the capitalist system; AND learning what dialectics are; AND understanding the shape of the aforementioned element as a dialectical contradiction between the forces of circulation and accumulation; AND seeing how other contradictions, such as those underlying imperialism and fascism, follow logically from it.

        Then you became an ML by realising that the only way to resolve these contradictions is to establish a workers’ state; AND that state will eventually turn out to be a council republic with some sort of democratically planned economy; AND that to protect this state, it is necessary to instantly build up the means of production and defence during a transitory phase; AND that the way to do this cannot be dogmatic but must be specifically tailored to the material conditions of the country and age; AND (not for Gonzaloists or Hoxhaists) that China is finding its way right now and can be studied as a successful example.

        Just the first step towards anti-capitalist leftism filters out the overwhelming part of society, as the default ideology in modern capitalism is liberalism. Not only that, but each step past that requires further learning still, and even when you have the time and energy to study enough to become a communist, personal experience with the military and police state can mess with you enough to make you ditch the notion of the transitory state and fall for the temptation of anarcho-communism. If someone is surrounded by people, institutions, and media they trust constantly indoctrinating them with liberal ideology, or have no one to guide them through that journey, no one with whom to learn together or to reach out to, then they are practically set up to drop out somewhere along the way and retreat.

    • @pgtl_10
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      42 years ago

      Libertarians have no coherent beliefs.