Apparently they withdrew from Izyum behind the Oskol river during the night. Unconfirmed reports are UAF crosses the Siversky Donets river largerly uncontested and are either fighting in or have already pushed the Russians out of Lyman.
All of this in the span of a few days without much resistance in crucial areas that took the allies months to take. No idea what to even say to this tbh.
I have no meaningful thing to add related to the topic as I don’t know what’s happening.
But I hope we can remain critical of what’s happening and not resort to copium. Russia might lose serious ground if they don’t have a plan. Would be stupid to mock the copium from the libs only to then fall back in the same copium.
My approach thus far as been a cautious ‘they fucked up a bit, hopefully they turn it around quick’ and now ‘they fucked up a LOT, they need to turn it around before this becomes even worse’. Apparently they are trying their best to evacuate civilians from the area in anticipation of retaliatory purges by the Ukranians, but it’s still a disaster and they really should just fucking declare war already.
I assume the Russian army has some competent people in charge to figure things out. It’s just strange that they seemingly go out without a fight. But then again I have zero knowledge about warfare.
Same here, I’m not even good at ‘map games’ lol. The explanation that has been given is they withdrew to prevent losses of personnel, rather than defending positions ‘at all costs’. That’s fine and good, but it’s a lot of land that they will have to retake, slowly, inch by inch. They don’t have the numbers for this shit, even ardently jingoistic guys like intelslava are saying that they need to just declare war so they can mobilise, cause it’s untenable relying on a pure volunteer force against the largest army in Europe (I presume except for Russia’s army?) coordinated by NATO’s top brass.
Yes, I am sure mass mobilization will earn Putin popularity. And I am sure conscripts will be of great use over there. Just look at Ukranian conscripts.
hey don’t shoot the messenger, this is what they said, I honestly have no idea and no one should trust my strategic or tactical advice. I can’t even win a game of warhammer 40k :P
I’m Russian. The perspective of my fat ass getting dragged into that fucking quagmire to die for some oligarch’s profits is unappealing to say the least.
I would feel the same.
So does losing a whole oblast within a couple of days and without much fighting. If they can’t beat them with their volunteer army and they can’t mobilize, they can’t win this conflict.
Those who scream the loudest about mobilization ought to be drafted first. That should cool off the heads.
I’m proud of Russia for its victories and for standing up for itself and the Ukrainian people in the East. I can’t say that Russia should have done nothing even if something has to be paid in blood.
If they’re current “special military operation” accomplishes what should be done at the most minimal price to its own people then I don’t see why a war should be declared because Americans are impatient to see immediate results.
That’s what I’m seeing here. The Russians are winning overall. They lost a little ground in order to minimize their own loses and overextend their greedy adversaries. Instead of waiting to see how the events payout some people are declaring for an escalation from the Russian side. If it was wise to do so they would have done it.
Abandoning their initial position would be a sign of weakness and uncertainty. Yet that’s what people would call for. From my perspective Russian victory relies on the West exhausting itself at the walls of Russia. Ukraine offers the greatest advantage for Russia in a war of attrician. The point of a war is not to overextend yourself or exert yourself. Let the adversary exhaust themselves. Let the adversary rush in while you retreat.
What do you think should rather happen?
Right now? Not sure anything can be done. More missile strikes at targets in Kiev or Lviv may not be enough. Sending hordes of conscripts won’t work. The longer this “operation” goes on, the less popular it is bound to become, and voices of liberal “opposition” will become louder.
So no, I don’t know what should rather happen. We seem to be screwed pretty much regardless.
I assume the Russians have competent military generals. Appearances matter little. It would have been an absence of competence to hold at great cost rather than retreat for tangible gains.
The point here isn’t to cope. Its to understand what’s happening, why, and what it means forward. If things turn poorly then we should acknowledge that ahead. It shows far greater amaterialism to throw off everything we know thus far at the first surface level sign that things aren’t going how we’d like.