Welcome again to everybody! Make yourself at home. Is anyone reading this? In the time-honoured tradition of our group, here is our weekly discussion thread!

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  • Darkerseid
    3·
    2 years ago

    About COVID, some of these lockdowns are a disaster. For example in India, the workers were driven off from the city having to walk 100s of kms and some of them died on the way. In some countries they are barred from going out without a vaccine. (and the only vaccine you can get is American made).

    Most of all these COVID measures were not scientific, purely a power grab and push more vaccines and boosters into people. Again I’m full for public health and safety but these need to be scientific and well tested.

    There are numerous reports of people having major side effects to COVID vaccines and in many cases deaths (due to heart attacks even little kids)

    • redtea
      3·
      2 years ago

      This seems to be anti-vaxx, but I’m open to you saying that I’ve misinterpreted you.

      Do you mean to say the vaccines aren’t scientific? I must challenge that view if so.

      I also think that if you bring up the injuries caused by side effects of Covid vaccines you also need to bring up:

      • the injuries caused by Covid itself in the same cohorts – my understanding is that fewer people suffer from vaccines than they would have if they had caught Covid.
      • the injury rate of other types of vaccination – it’s problematic to suggest that Covid vaccines are especially dangerous without comparing the stats for other vaccines.
      • Darkerseid
        2·
        2 years ago

        Vaccines are scientific but they need to be thoroughly tested before administering to everyone. I was talking about COVID vaccine injuries and other side effects (pushing mRNA vaccines for example, there is a reason China didn’t agree to creating one, it’s not tested enough)

        • redtea
          4·
          2 years ago

          In that case, I think I still need to challenge this view that Covid vaccines were not scientific. I agree there were problems, but this is a universal feature of bourgeois science. That doesn’t mean the process is unscientific.

          It also leads to another question:

          • what are the stats for non mRNA vaccines – we can’t conclude that they’re better without comparing the data.

          I’ll also suggest that mRNA Covid vaccines were quite thoroughly tested and, in the time scale, ensured better outcomes than not vaccinating at all (so as to wait for more results).

          And I don’t think it’s as simple as comparing the scientific differences between China and the west in relation to vaccines. China had the luxury of time by virtue of its communist leadership. Western states tried repeatedly and eventually just abandoned their populations to Covid. They rested their whole approach on the idea that technology (vaccines) would save us because they could not conceive of controlling capitalism. So the problem is not the science, but capitalism. This does mean that I partially agree with you: without capitalism, we could have better science, and could base public health policy on science.