By Tyler Lyons On My Life Before Joining the Party Long before the onset of the COVID pandemic, I was struggling with my political identity. I had been disillusioned with…
Noone talking about national liberation here, we are talking about patriotism. I guess the Communist Party of Greece are reactionary patsocs then lol ¯_(ツ)_/¯
But sure, you can just accuse me of “being an american chauvinist” i guess, even tho im a spaniard with no relation to the anglosphere whatsoever, english isnt even my native language. The truth is, as that Mao quote clearly states, that all communists must be patriots. And that doesnt mean “praising your government” or “praising your flag” or anything like that. It just means you love your country and its people. There is nothing more patriotic than being a communist, communist parties all over the world acknowledge this, in Latin America, Europe, Africa, Asia and Oceania. Its only in the USA that you deny this. My guess is because you have been brainwashed by your media and education system that patriotism is bootlicking the flag, the police, the military and the Founding Fathers. Patriotism is noone of that. Noone who advocates for capitalism is a patriot, since they are more than happy to let their people suffer in misery. This is the truth, the whole world except you recognizes it.
Also sectarian? What is this lie? The KKE is anything but sectarian. They literally have an “independent party policy”, which means that, no matter what the position of the party on something is, they will not cut ties with other communist parties even if there are big disagreements. As long as a party is communist, they consider them comrades. Thats why they created the International Meeting of Communist and Workers Party, where they regularly invite communist parties from all around the world with very different ideologies, some even pacifist reformists like the Communist Party of Japan. They also invite CPUSA, which you seem to like. But yeah sure, KKE is sectarian.
They are not anti AES, they have bilateral ties with the CPC and regularly invite them to the aforementioned meeting. They are just critical of chinese investment in Greece, and frankly you cant blame them, many greek workers have died in workplace accidents at chinese owned firms, and the chinese investors have been anything but helpful, instead choosing to barricade themselves with lawyers, rather than paying reparations. I personally think its the greek governments fault, not Chinas, but you cant blame the KKE for being suspicious of this.
They did not even attend the meeting hosted by the CPC. They have expressed “critical support” over nebulous shit like… trade. Wow. Such great criticism. Very original.
They literally invited the CPC to Greece several times, along with the cuban, laotian, vietnamese and north korean parties. They literally support China dude, all they disagree in (omg, a disagreement, how dare they, so antimarxist to have debates and different opinions) is chinese investment in capitalist countries, since it benefits off the labour of the workers there while they dont even get a seat at the negotiating table.
So? You original accusation was that the KKE was “homophobic sectarian”. Now we are dialing it back to left deviationist. Good job, thanks for admitting you lied.
Seriously, why are you americans all so stupid and arrogant? One would think that ML americans, with their rejection of american exceptionalism, would be humble and not make universal proclamations when they are first world priviliged kids with a terrible education system who know nothing about anything. But no, you still act like you know everything, smugly dismissing entire workers movements without even bothering to research them. I cannot believe the GULL for an american, member of the CPUSA, a party with a MINUSCULE membership (5000 according to Wikipedia, dont know if its true), a party that has achieved NOTHING since the USSR collapsed (the most theyve done is support the democrats), for you to be dismissing the KKE, a massive party, a party that organizes general nationwide strikes, a party that gets hundreds of thousands of votes, a party that has NEVER endorsed liberal parties or candidates, for YOU to dismiss THEM, is so ARROGANT its unbelievable.
I didnt wanna write this comment, because i believe being polite is important, but this is unacceptable, i cant stand this. For an AMERICAN, a citizen of the top imperialist power, member of a completely useless party that has no strenght, for YOU to denigrate and dismiss workers struggles in the countries YOUR government oppresses, is pure unadulterated ARROGANCE. Do you even know all the history of US meddling in Greece? Greece has suffered several fascist dictatorships propped up by the USA. And you know who was at the forefront of the resistance to these dictatorships? The KKE. All of this for a stupid yankee idiot to come and dismiss all of this. How many general nationwide strikes have you organized and led huh? What authority do you have to dismiss popular mass workers movements like that huh? NONE. I will NOT tolerate a stupid ignorant and arrogant american to denigrate the people oppressed by his taxpayer money. I WONT.
I have no problem with you disagreeing with my opinions, but this is unacceptable. Our conversation is DONE. Despite you thinking you are so smart and “free from the biases of being american”, its evident you are just as stupid and arrogant as your typical anticommunist John Doe. You may not see it, but the rest of the world does. You wanna fight imperialism? Start by SHUTTING UP and LEARNING from the rest of the world, who have much more experience at fighting imperialism than you or your entire country has, instead of blabbering without knowledge like you are right now. Exercise some HUMILITY for ONCE.
Also to debunk your slanderous LIE about the KKE not attending the 2016 IMCWP because “they hate China”. Very few parties attended that meeting, due to serious ideological rifts that year. That year, of the 118 members of the IMCWP, only FOUR attended. Including those who did not attend, is your beloved CPUSA. But yes, im sure this was the KKE alone just hating China.
Ohhh, there we go, if you are homophobic then you are not a communist. So the strongest nonrevisionist/reformist communist party in the EU, the only strong EU communist party that has not joined NATO in its antiRussia crusade, the only EU communist party that consistently fights labor struggles for workers rights, that advocates revolution, that praises Stalin and denounces Khrushchev, is a reactionary party. Got it. I bet you love trotskyite parties that get 300 votes while spreading antiChina rhethoric.
Then i guess the USSR and the CPSU were evil reactionary patsocs. Same with Cold War era Cuba and its Communist Party. Also the modern day Russian, Belarusian, Moldovan, Lithuanian, Latvian, Estonian, and many more Communist Parties. Also the DPRK and its Workers Party. Also the Communist Party of China. Yep, they are all evil, they are homophobic, and thats the most important contradiction, forget imperialism!
Wow, and you call yourself a communist? Rejecting an entire mass movement, one of the few strong principled Communist parties that still remain today, just because of social conservatism? You are not a communist, you are a proimperialist moron, thats what you are.
Keep lying. Golden Dawn has ZERO seats in Parliament. How the fuck would the KKE support them if they didnt even get into parliament? Besides, Golden Dawns leadership was recently arrested and imprisoned, after 5 years of protests asking the government to do so. And you know who led these protests? The KKE you stupid fuck. Golden Dawn literally targeted KKE members all the time you stupid ignorant muppet. They have demanded in their articles that Golden Dawn be shut down and banned for years. Here is an example:
What neonazis did they support? And yes, the Communist Party of China, Workers Party of Korea, Lao Peoples Revolutionary Party and even the Communist Party of Vietnam are homophobic nowadays, in 2022. Do you condemn those too as reactionary?
Ah yes, the CPC is not homophobic when they ban “sissy men”. The WPK also isnt homophobic when they say “there are no transgenders/homosexuals in DPRK, thats a western thing”. Same goes for Laos and Vietnam, although Vietnam to a lesser degree but still.
"In December, the country’s education authorities responded for the first time to a controversial proposal raising alarm about a perceived deterioration of masculinity in Chinese boys.
In the “Proposal to Prevent the Feminization of Male Adolescents,” Si Zefu, a delegate to China’s top political advisory body, said that Chinese boys are becoming “weak, timid and low self-esteemed,” traits which he summed up in one word: feminization."
Literally rambling about “chinese boys losing their masculinity due to “sissy pants artists””. Very LGBT friendly LMFAO
There was funny thread few months ago at GenZedong, where you got your usual interview with DPRK man, then he started to say against LGBT, and the usual GenZedong uncritical support for DPRK fizzled for this one thread only, and they were like “Based… wait what? That’s surely a coincidence, how can a a man in country i uncritically support have opinion i do not uncritically support”. What was characteristic is that no discussion happened and the thread was largely ignored.
Do you have that thread saved somewhere? Id like to read it. I didnt see it since i havent used r/GenZedong since the mod purge. The new mods are rabid antiRussia and i cant stand that.
I agree, western left (more like USA left tbh, in Europe there are dumb people but not that many) is so dogmatic at times. Like they will understand nuance when it comes to authoritarianism and so on, and will mock twitter anarchists for failing to do so, but then they will do the exact same thing regarding tabboo topics like patriotism and LGBT. And i wanna make clear that i fully support LGBT rights and i think its wrong that some socialist countries oppress them. But im not gonna stop supporting them just for that, im sorry for LGBT people but imperialism is more important to address for now. They are also extremely inconsistent. This guy denounced KKE just because they are mildly homophobic, but i dont see him denouncing Iran, where gay people are literally hanged, something horrific in my opinion.
I also understand why LGBT people may feel angry towards such a policy, i feel this in my own skin. Im a drug user/exdrug addict and i believe drugs should be legalized. The way China treats drug addicts is horrible in my opinion, but im not gonna start supporting imperialism just for that!
You are coping so much its insane. If China and DPRK are soooooo LGBT friendly, as you claim, where the fuck are the pride parades? Where are the LGBT advocacy groups? Are you seriously denying the insane bigotry LGBT people face in Asia? Look at how CGTN talks about “sissy feminine men”:
"In December, the country’s education authorities responded for the first time to a controversial proposal raising alarm about a perceived deterioration of masculinity in Chinese boys.
In the “Proposal to Prevent the Feminization of Male Adolescents,” Si Zefu, a delegate to China’s top political advisory body, said that Chinese boys are becoming “weak, timid and low self-esteemed,” traits which he summed up in one word: feminization."
Noone talking about national liberation here, we are talking about patriotism. I guess the Communist Party of Greece are reactionary patsocs then lol ¯_(ツ)_/¯
https://www.rizospastis.gr/story.do?id=209459
https://www.rizospastis.gr/story.do?id=329397
Its in greek but just use google translate.
But sure, you can just accuse me of “being an american chauvinist” i guess, even tho im a spaniard with no relation to the anglosphere whatsoever, english isnt even my native language. The truth is, as that Mao quote clearly states, that all communists must be patriots. And that doesnt mean “praising your government” or “praising your flag” or anything like that. It just means you love your country and its people. There is nothing more patriotic than being a communist, communist parties all over the world acknowledge this, in Latin America, Europe, Africa, Asia and Oceania. Its only in the USA that you deny this. My guess is because you have been brainwashed by your media and education system that patriotism is bootlicking the flag, the police, the military and the Founding Fathers. Patriotism is noone of that. Noone who advocates for capitalism is a patriot, since they are more than happy to let their people suffer in misery. This is the truth, the whole world except you recognizes it.
The KKE is pretty sectarian and cringe and homophobic/transphobic, yes.
Also sectarian? What is this lie? The KKE is anything but sectarian. They literally have an “independent party policy”, which means that, no matter what the position of the party on something is, they will not cut ties with other communist parties even if there are big disagreements. As long as a party is communist, they consider them comrades. Thats why they created the International Meeting of Communist and Workers Party, where they regularly invite communist parties from all around the world with very different ideologies, some even pacifist reformists like the Communist Party of Japan. They also invite CPUSA, which you seem to like. But yeah sure, KKE is sectarian.
They are anti-China and anti-AES.
lmao
They are not anti AES, they have bilateral ties with the CPC and regularly invite them to the aforementioned meeting. They are just critical of chinese investment in Greece, and frankly you cant blame them, many greek workers have died in workplace accidents at chinese owned firms, and the chinese investors have been anything but helpful, instead choosing to barricade themselves with lawyers, rather than paying reparations. I personally think its the greek governments fault, not Chinas, but you cant blame the KKE for being suspicious of this.
They did not even attend the meeting hosted by the CPC. They have expressed “critical support” over nebulous shit like… trade. Wow. Such great criticism. Very original.
They literally invited the CPC to Greece several times, along with the cuban, laotian, vietnamese and north korean parties. They literally support China dude, all they disagree in (omg, a disagreement, how dare they, so antimarxist to have debates and different opinions) is chinese investment in capitalist countries, since it benefits off the labour of the workers there while they dont even get a seat at the negotiating table.
lmao This is literally a left deviationist talking point that could be applied to Mao.
Ha
So? You original accusation was that the KKE was “homophobic sectarian”. Now we are dialing it back to left deviationist. Good job, thanks for admitting you lied.
Seriously, why are you americans all so stupid and arrogant? One would think that ML americans, with their rejection of american exceptionalism, would be humble and not make universal proclamations when they are first world priviliged kids with a terrible education system who know nothing about anything. But no, you still act like you know everything, smugly dismissing entire workers movements without even bothering to research them. I cannot believe the GULL for an american, member of the CPUSA, a party with a MINUSCULE membership (5000 according to Wikipedia, dont know if its true), a party that has achieved NOTHING since the USSR collapsed (the most theyve done is support the democrats), for you to be dismissing the KKE, a massive party, a party that organizes general nationwide strikes, a party that gets hundreds of thousands of votes, a party that has NEVER endorsed liberal parties or candidates, for YOU to dismiss THEM, is so ARROGANT its unbelievable.
I didnt wanna write this comment, because i believe being polite is important, but this is unacceptable, i cant stand this. For an AMERICAN, a citizen of the top imperialist power, member of a completely useless party that has no strenght, for YOU to denigrate and dismiss workers struggles in the countries YOUR government oppresses, is pure unadulterated ARROGANCE. Do you even know all the history of US meddling in Greece? Greece has suffered several fascist dictatorships propped up by the USA. And you know who was at the forefront of the resistance to these dictatorships? The KKE. All of this for a stupid yankee idiot to come and dismiss all of this. How many general nationwide strikes have you organized and led huh? What authority do you have to dismiss popular mass workers movements like that huh? NONE. I will NOT tolerate a stupid ignorant and arrogant american to denigrate the people oppressed by his taxpayer money. I WONT.
I have no problem with you disagreeing with my opinions, but this is unacceptable. Our conversation is DONE. Despite you thinking you are so smart and “free from the biases of being american”, its evident you are just as stupid and arrogant as your typical anticommunist John Doe. You may not see it, but the rest of the world does. You wanna fight imperialism? Start by SHUTTING UP and LEARNING from the rest of the world, who have much more experience at fighting imperialism than you or your entire country has, instead of blabbering without knowledge like you are right now. Exercise some HUMILITY for ONCE.
Also to debunk your slanderous LIE about the KKE not attending the 2016 IMCWP because “they hate China”. Very few parties attended that meeting, due to serious ideological rifts that year. That year, of the 118 members of the IMCWP, only FOUR attended. Including those who did not attend, is your beloved CPUSA. But yes, im sure this was the KKE alone just hating China.
Source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Meeting_of_Communist_and_Workers'_Parties
I said no such thing, but in the most recent international meeting with communist parties they were not present
What are you talking about? 2022? Because until 2021 the KKE attended ALL meetings except the 2016 one.
Ohhh, there we go, if you are homophobic then you are not a communist. So the strongest nonrevisionist/reformist communist party in the EU, the only strong EU communist party that has not joined NATO in its antiRussia crusade, the only EU communist party that consistently fights labor struggles for workers rights, that advocates revolution, that praises Stalin and denounces Khrushchev, is a reactionary party. Got it. I bet you love trotskyite parties that get 300 votes while spreading antiChina rhethoric.
Then i guess the USSR and the CPSU were evil reactionary patsocs. Same with Cold War era Cuba and its Communist Party. Also the modern day Russian, Belarusian, Moldovan, Lithuanian, Latvian, Estonian, and many more Communist Parties. Also the DPRK and its Workers Party. Also the Communist Party of China. Yep, they are all evil, they are homophobic, and thats the most important contradiction, forget imperialism!
Wow, and you call yourself a communist? Rejecting an entire mass movement, one of the few strong principled Communist parties that still remain today, just because of social conservatism? You are not a communist, you are a proimperialist moron, thats what you are.
We should also rename the Great Patriotic War apparently :/
Socialism is when LGBT rights, the more LGBT rights the more socialister it is, and when you have no LGBTphobia, then its communism.
They supported neo-Nazis only a few years ago over some liberal candidate. And they’re incredibly homophobic/transphobic in 2022.
Go away.
Will you substantiate your accusation of the KKE collaborating with nazis?
It was literally in the most recent elections where they supported the Golden Sun or whatever they call themselves nowadays haha
Keep lying. Golden Dawn has ZERO seats in Parliament. How the fuck would the KKE support them if they didnt even get into parliament? Besides, Golden Dawns leadership was recently arrested and imprisoned, after 5 years of protests asking the government to do so. And you know who led these protests? The KKE you stupid fuck. Golden Dawn literally targeted KKE members all the time you stupid ignorant muppet. They have demanded in their articles that Golden Dawn be shut down and banned for years. Here is an example:
https://inter.kke.gr/en/articles/The-people-demand-the-Nazis-to-be-imprisoned/
KKE literally endorsed them over the other bourgeois candidates.
WHERE? SHOW EVIDENCE YOU LYING FUCK!
What neonazis did they support? And yes, the Communist Party of China, Workers Party of Korea, Lao Peoples Revolutionary Party and even the Communist Party of Vietnam are homophobic nowadays, in 2022. Do you condemn those too as reactionary?
They are absolutely not homophobic; they are all that stand in the way of homophobia lmao
Ah yes, the CPC is not homophobic when they ban “sissy men”. The WPK also isnt homophobic when they say “there are no transgenders/homosexuals in DPRK, thats a western thing”. Same goes for Laos and Vietnam, although Vietnam to a lesser degree but still.
China never banned “sissy men” that was a mistranslation.
It was not a mistranslation. Read this CGTN article about this same topic in 2021:
https://news.cgtn.com/news/2021-03-04/China-debates-masculinity-education-for-boys-YmjSM7bjVe/index.html
"In December, the country’s education authorities responded for the first time to a controversial proposal raising alarm about a perceived deterioration of masculinity in Chinese boys.
In the “Proposal to Prevent the Feminization of Male Adolescents,” Si Zefu, a delegate to China’s top political advisory body, said that Chinese boys are becoming “weak, timid and low self-esteemed,” traits which he summed up in one word: feminization."
Literally rambling about “chinese boys losing their masculinity due to “sissy pants artists””. Very LGBT friendly LMFAO
There was funny thread few months ago at GenZedong, where you got your usual interview with DPRK man, then he started to say against LGBT, and the usual GenZedong uncritical support for DPRK fizzled for this one thread only, and they were like “Based… wait what? That’s surely a coincidence, how can a a man in country i uncritically support have opinion i do not uncritically support”. What was characteristic is that no discussion happened and the thread was largely ignored.
Western left moment.
Do you have that thread saved somewhere? Id like to read it. I didnt see it since i havent used r/GenZedong since the mod purge. The new mods are rabid antiRussia and i cant stand that.
I agree, western left (more like USA left tbh, in Europe there are dumb people but not that many) is so dogmatic at times. Like they will understand nuance when it comes to authoritarianism and so on, and will mock twitter anarchists for failing to do so, but then they will do the exact same thing regarding tabboo topics like patriotism and LGBT. And i wanna make clear that i fully support LGBT rights and i think its wrong that some socialist countries oppress them. But im not gonna stop supporting them just for that, im sorry for LGBT people but imperialism is more important to address for now. They are also extremely inconsistent. This guy denounced KKE just because they are mildly homophobic, but i dont see him denouncing Iran, where gay people are literally hanged, something horrific in my opinion.
I also understand why LGBT people may feel angry towards such a policy, i feel this in my own skin. Im a drug user/exdrug addict and i believe drugs should be legalized. The way China treats drug addicts is horrible in my opinion, but im not gonna start supporting imperialism just for that!
They did not lol
You are coping so much its insane. If China and DPRK are soooooo LGBT friendly, as you claim, where the fuck are the pride parades? Where are the LGBT advocacy groups? Are you seriously denying the insane bigotry LGBT people face in Asia? Look at how CGTN talks about “sissy feminine men”:
"In December, the country’s education authorities responded for the first time to a controversial proposal raising alarm about a perceived deterioration of masculinity in Chinese boys.
In the “Proposal to Prevent the Feminization of Male Adolescents,” Si Zefu, a delegate to China’s top political advisory body, said that Chinese boys are becoming “weak, timid and low self-esteemed,” traits which he summed up in one word: feminization."
Source: https://news.cgtn.com/news/2021-03-04/China-debates-masculinity-education-for-boys-YmjSM7bjVe/index.html