What do you call indescrimate shooting at civilians in the hope to kill terrorists, the systematic displacement of civilians, the cutting off of crucial infrastructure and aid?
I really would love to ask Biden that.
You’re nice saying they hope to shoot terrorist in the process…
Tuesday
Many different u.s. interventions over the years.
What terrorists? Israel legally speaking Israel does not have the right to defend itself. Oct 7 was a success MILITARY operation and no, mass rape and the other atrocity propaganda did not happen.
They may not have done the biggest atrocities that were rumored, but they still purposefully kidnapped civilians, which I’m pretty sure is a war crime.
A MILITARY operation on a fucking festival and a kibbutz?
I’m pro-Palestine, I think what Israel is doing in Gaza is definitely a genocide, but seriously, what do you think would happen from a geopolitical standpoint if Biden said “yeah, I think the ICC is right, please stop this genocide Bibi”? The US can’t afford to lose Israel as an ally so it needs to be subtle.
This is a sick way of thinking, that we would have allies in spite of them committing genocide, but neither is it new territory for the US. That said, what is the ‘realpolitik’ reason that we “can’t afford to lose Israel as an ally”?
Seriously, we already left Saudi Arabia get away with chopping up a journalist for a US publication for that reason. And have a base in Iraq. And ostensibly Pakistan is our ally. And Turkey is in NATO. How many allies do we need in that area? And why do they all have to be terrible?
What’s the reason why the US can’t afford to lose Israel?
Israel and the US share a lot of Intel and military technologies.
I’m not saying that the US shouldn’t ditch Israel - they should, but they need to undo a few ties first. People here expect it done in a few weeks and that won’t happen.
Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
The current US president has answered this very clearly.
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I’m open-source; check me out at GitHub.
Counterpoint: it’s an election year and Biden does not want to lose the Jewish Dem vote.
The system is fucked.
That too
The US can’t afford to lose Israel as an ally so it needs to be subtle.
Israel is not in any way a critical US ally. Their influence in the region is basically non-existent and their inclusion in our various Middle Eastern adventures would do more harm than good so they’re never asked. They’re a client state heavily dependent on US arms and diplomatic protection, not some highly desirable ally we need to carefully court.
This is not true. Israel is most certainly America’s crucial ally. Are American politicians funneling money into Israel (more so than any other country in history even ukraine) just for fun?
What is Biden’s definition of a genocide then? I am seriously curious.
Because many people that are leaving his cabinet, they seem to think it is a genocide.
Students seem to think it’s a genocide.
The public thinks it’s a genocide.
The Jewish and Israeli population think it is a genocide.
So… everyone else is wrong then?
In the end, it doesn’t matter how he defines it. We are signatories to the UN and the UN definition in Article II of the “Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide” is:
https://www.un.org/en/genocideprevention/genocide.shtml
"In the present Convention, genocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:
a) Killing members of the group;
b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;
c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;
d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group."
Note the language: “ANY of the following acts”.
Israel is now 5/5 with the relocation of children from Gaza to the West Bank.
I’ve heard the argument that it isn’t genocide because Isreal doesn’t intend to destroy Palestinians. I guess their defense is that Isreal is just incredibly inept at fighting a war? I don’t buy it. How anyone can deny the genocide after the World Central Kitchen incident is beyond me.
Note the language: “ANY of the following acts”.
Meaning a) would indicate any nation at war with a nation with a defined identity (most ).
Is technically guilty.
I am not questioning if Israel is. There actions are over the top whatever.
But that definition is extreamly broard in a world that dosenot ban defensive wars. Few would argue a single response on a nation that attacked yours is invalid.
Yet by that definition. Hamas committed genocide on Oct 7 and Israel repeated it with their first response.
Absolutely no violent attack on one nation from another. Dose not involve killing members of a nation ethnic or religious group. As that describes every one.
So seems like a law very open to being considered wrong and reinterpretation as the nation considers it.
The reading comprehension devil strikes again.
The convention says that these acts must be committed with the intent of destroying an identity, and not simply committing them against a group with an idenity
Giving it the opposite issue,
Thanks for updating me BTW.
But that then make it impossible to proove in any case where the commiter is not vocal…
IE if Israel says its self defence. Absolutly no one can proove their motive.
Allowing crap like the claims all folks objecting are just antisemitic. Cos lets face it. There history was one of the few cases where the nazis were open about plans.
That part is true. It is usually extremely difficult to prove. It’s why the case on whether it’s genocide can take years. And why people saying the ICC hasn’t said its 100% genocide yet aren’t arguing in good faith. They said it’s plausible, which is already huge. Anything more wasn’t realistic, as it will take them most likely literal years to finish the case out, but we can call it as we see it before then.
In this case, it’s still okay for everyone else to say it because we don’t have to prove it legally, and it’s pretty obvious to the eye and ear with the mountain of evidence given by South Africa. Luckily, Israeli government officials and soldiers have said openly many statements basically proving that they want to do a genocide. They’ve called Palestinians animals, compared Gaza to Amalek, said they need to erase the Gaza strip from the earth, said there are no involved civilians, been encouraging another ethnic cleansing through emigration as well (“If there are 100,000 or 200,000 Arabs in Gaza and not 2 million Arabs, the entire discussion on the day after will be totally different.”), etc. Those quotes and statements have always helped me feel more comfortable calling it what it is.
Fair points.
In order to be classified as a genocide, it has to fulfill these two criteria:
- Be a genocide
- Not be committed by me or my allies
It’s that simple!
Genocide-lite? It could get a lot more genocidal.
It is not genocide. In about 2 minutes or less, the entire palastinian population could be wiped out.
How? With a nuke? In that close of proximity with the Israeli mainland?
They have to maintain some veneer of legitimacy for international audience as well. They’re not going to nuke Gaza lol. Other than that, they’re going at a pretty damn good click, though. They got down to only one major city left and Northern Gaza is completely uninhabitable.
I got you Joe, right here:
“It also said no aid trucks have entered the territory in the past two days via a floating pier set up by the US for sea deliveries, and warned that the $320m (£250m) project may fail unless Israel starts providing the conditions humanitarian groups need to operate safely.”
"The UN Genocide Convention lists five acts that fall under its definition. … Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part.”
Please don’t post google amp links.
Another source for anyone interested.
Post your own post bro
AMP links are bad for security. In an ideal scenario, there should be a bot to fix this link, but please respect the rule of the instance you’re posting on - lemmy.ml is a privacy-oriented Lemmy instance. The commentator above you shared a proper link with you, instead of complaining, all you have to do is just edit your original post link with what they have shared.
Why would I spam the /c/. Let the news sites get their ad money instead of google stealing it.
Changed it
Thank you.
His point just isn’t convincing.
@CerealOverdose666@discuss.online, please replace the Google AMP link with the original: https://www.aljazeera.com/program/newsfeed/2024/5/21/whats-happening-is-not-genocide-says-biden-after-icc-seeks-warrants
Thanks
“It’s not what it looks like” I say after being stopped in the Red Lobster parking lot with my JNCO pants overflowing with shrimp
Feeding anyone shrimp you have kept in you pants. Def needs adding to the genocide definition.
Under imposing measures intended to prevent birth. As you and anyone accepting them I Will def be single.
But please still vote for me in the elections, I totally got thoughts and prayers for the victims of Israeli degeneracy but hands are tied! AIPAC is a good guy, dindu nuffin!
Yes, don’t vote for him. The fascist wannabe dictator that wants Israel to nuke Gaza instead is a much better option.
Honestly, it’ll be easier to hold Biden accountable for this bullshit by keeping him in office. Can’t say that for the other guy, so why would we vote for that?
Stop assuming critcism of Biden equates to an endorsement of Trump. Its gross.
But the thing that’s happening in Xinjiang that there’s no evidence for, that’s totally a genocide. Trust me bro.
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I generally recoil from comparing biden to putin but this really requires russian levels of post-truth politics.
Israel is committing war crimes like trump commits all his crimes - openly, in public and shielded by US elites.
Sure thing “not genocide” Joe.
US investigated themselves and found themselves innocent of all blame in the murder of thousands of people. Israel was innocent too, funny that. No need to check.
The human brain has two halves, one left and one right. The problem with US presidents is that in the left one remains nothing right and in the right one are nothing left.
Here’s an alternative source being that OPs isn’t working for me https://www.axios.com/2024/05/20/biden-reaction-netanyahu-arrest-warrants-gaza
You know, there’s another candidate for the election?
- 🗹 Not Trump
- ☐ Trump
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Literally Anybody Else is the name
International Criminal Court specialising in identifying such crimes vs the accomplice of the accused…
…hmmm, who is more qualified and less biased I wonder?
