Hi folks,

Today we’ll be discussing:

Revolution in the Revolution - Régis Debray

Today’s discussion is:

  • 1/18 - Discussion 2 - “The Principle Lesson for the Present”, “Some Consequences for the Future”, summary discussion on the whole book.

I’m reading the Grove press edition translated by Bobbye Ortiz. These seem to be some digital copies, but please share if you find a better one!

https://archive.org/details/revolutioninrevo0000regi_p5g2/page/n5/mode/2up

http://libgen.is/book/index.php?md5=CA5F03D21F0EED6587F9663A5FDA5D8D

Discussion Prompts

These are some ideas to address while considering this work. None of them are essential, and any of your own thoughts are very much welcome! I’ll be adding my own thoughts later today.

  • What is Debray saying and how is he saying it?

  • What has he missed? Is he wrong about anything?

  • Did anything surprise you?

  • Is this work applicable outside of the conditions of Latin America in the '60s? What parts are universally applicable?

  • Is this really a “nonessential” or would it be good for any communist to read it?

Next Discussion

Next week will be:

  • 1/25 - “Make Way for Winged Eros” - Alexandra Kollontai

https://www.marxists.org/archive/kollonta/1923/winged-eros.htm

Next Title

If you would like to suggest the title for 2/1 , please put in a separate comment with the words “submission suggestion”. I think the highest voted title should win.

Books should be:

  • not suggested for beginners.
  • not overly technical or philosophical (I’m just not smart enough to lead those discussions).
  • relatively short (so as not to lose too much momentum).
  • regionally or subject specific (like Che’s Guerilla Warfare is topically specific, or Decolonization is Not a Metaphor is regionally specific?).
  • readily available.

Thanks for your time! :)

  • @redtea
    link
    51 year ago

    The ‘Principal Lessons for the Present’ are interesting.

    The chapter begins again with questions. What is more important, the party or the guerrillas? ‘Which is the decisive link? Where should the principal effort be made?’

    The orthodox answer would have revolutionaries rely on the party. Debray rejects this. He cites Castro favourably, as saying that a vanguard is necessary to make a revolution, but the vanguard does not have to be Marxist-Leninist:

    There is … no metaphysical equation in which vanguard = Marxist-Leninist party; there are merely dialectical conjunctions between a given function—that of the vanguard in history—and a given form of organization—that of the Marxist-Leninist party.

    In the run up to this quote, Debray notes that the guerrilla organ can have a political and military leadership, as in Vietnam (Ho Chi Minh and Giap), China (Mao and Chu Teh) and the USSR (Lenin and Trotsky). But in Cuba, both functions fell to Castro.

    Debray argues that the dialectic of vanguard/party and of it’s leadership depends on how it arises, it’s material preconditions.

    In China, the revolutionaries arose alongside Sun Yat-sen and the Kuomintang and found support from the Soviet Union. They soon faced disaster an urban revolutionary war. The third international’s line was to hold the line, but under Mao’s self criticism, they withdraw to the countryside.

    The Vietnamese revolutionaries organised peasant insurrections in rural areas. These failed, to begin with, so the line was revised. Ho Chi Minh turned towards ‘armed mass struggle’. It was the peasants who ‘establish[ed] soviet power’, according to Giap.

    In China and Vietnam, revolutionaries transformed themselves

    into vanguard parties, each one with its own political line, elaborated independently of international social forces, and each profoundly linked to its people.

    In these examples and with the Bolsheviks, the revolutionary

    anti-feudal revolt was … transformed into an anti-imperialist revolt, the latter giving impetus to the former. The class struggle took the form of a patriotic war, and the establishment of socialism corresponded to the restoration of national independence: the two are linked.

    The people involved in this organisation ‘achieved in practice the alliance of the majority class and the vanguard class: the worker-peasant alliance’. It would be tempting to read this as suggesting that the vanguard/guerrillas should be a spontaneous organisation. But we know from the earlier chapters that Debray argues against spontaneity.

    So what is Debray saying? He seems to be arguing that although the vanguard (responsible for armed military struggle) should be organised, its work should not be determined by a separate political party. Although, so long as committees, commissions, etc, etc, are avoided (so as to allow the military organ the capacity to respond to things quickly), political representatives can join the guerrillas, because what is needed is a ‘new organisation’.

    Exact forms of organisation must depend on the circumstances, even if this contradicts orthodox theory. Indeed, the vanguard needs a ‘new style of leadership’ and a ‘perfect Marxist education is not, at the outset, an imperative condition’.

    Debray seems to use guerilla, vanguard, revolutionaries, etc as interchangeable in places, but I’m unsure if I’ve missed a subtlety here.

    • diegeticscream[all]🔻OP
      link
      31 year ago

      Thank you for sharing your thoughts! I really like the way you read and think about this.

      I’ll confess that I’m a little confused as to what Debray’s offering as a solution, but I do find his criticisms compelling. Thank you for bringing in his earlier criticisms against spontaneity here!

      • @redtea
        link
        3
        edit-2
        1 year ago

        Thank you, too.

        I’ll try to have another read through tomorrow and see if I can work that out. His final message seems to be a little spread out, so I agree it’s hard to pin down his solution in a single sentence. I wonder if a couple of his main arguments is simply to reject dogmatism, promote independent and effective organisation, and to argue in favour of letting-things-develop-as-necessary-depending-on-the circumstances?

        Edit: another thought, reading back over that Castro quote. Is he saying that the vanguard need not be ML? Or is he only arguing that it need not be an ML party? Would that change the argument? (He still makes the other points about Marxist education….)

        • diegeticscream[all]🔻OP
          link
          41 year ago

          It sounded to me like he’s arguing against organizing around solely political lines (an ML party) and arguing for organizing towards specific material goals (i.e. freeing Cuba).

          I do think I’ll get more from re-reading this, though!