I’m “debating” a Liberal who thinks “Marx had some valid critiques of capitalism” and “the US has done some bad things” but isn’t great on AES. I sent them the recent post showing that China doesn’t block western media, and they said that it only shows one computer and smart people can get around blocked stuff, and I explained what it actually shows before they said “China is still more authoritarian than the US and my personal freedoms aren’t stopped by my government” (note: all of these are paraphrases, but I don’t think I’ve strawmanned anything). So, what are some solid examples of the average citizens in socialist countries having more “freedom” than in capitalist countries? Edit: Thanks for all the great responses!
Its a problematic question, because authoritarianism here is just being used as a dogwhistle for socialism, so the question becomes “how is china less socialist than US?”. You’re not arguing that socialism is good here, you’re agreeing it’s bad and countering them by saying America is even more socialist, a specious argument at best
“It is difficult for me to imagine what “personal liberty” is enjoyed by an unemployed person, who goes about hungry, and cannot find employment.
Real liberty can exist only where exploitation has been abolished, where there is no oppression of some by others, where there is no unemployment and poverty, where a man is not haunted by the fear of being tomorrow deprived of work, of home and of bread. Only in such a society is real, and not paper, personal and every other liberty possible.”
― Joseph Stalin
You articulated exactly what my thoughts were. The primary goal of socialism isn’t to enact more libertarian policies but to create a state which better serves the welfare and interest of it’s lower class workers, for example providing better public transport.