I really stepped in it last night. My partner is livid with me for suggesting Stalin wasn’t the evil dictator he’s made out to be in the west. For a German who grew up with anti-communism and went to some very liberal universities for political science it was too much. They said something to the effect of “this feels exactly like if you said, oh Hitler wasn’t that bad, he was actually a good guy.” We’re in the midst of planning our wedding and they were suddenly at the point of doubting that they know who I am and if this is a relationship they want to maintain.
We have a hard time discussing politics as it is. We are still not so great at interpreting the nuances of way each other speaks, and our background knowledge is very different. So we have to figure out what we do from here.
I can’t come at this from the direction of “trying to convert them.” They already think I have gone into a conspiracy theory ridden and propaganda laden hole, and believe me, I ask myself the same thing every day. It really weighs heavily on me, as some of our close family members have fallen into conspiracy theory echo chambers.
We’ve decided we need to go back to basics and make sure our core values align, which I genuinely believe they do. They’re an anti-capitalist as well, although don’t have a strong idea of what to would be better, just that it shouldn’t be communism.
I’m not sure where to go after we sort out what our shared values are.
There’s a certain condescension I sense when it comes to the leftist sources I read, many on recommendation from GenZedong members. I’m often met with “leftists just make up all kinds of stuff to suit their narrative,” or “how do you know that’s a primary or reliable secondary source, it’s so easy to fake anything these days.” Meanwhile they go to Wikipedia and see that Stalin killed millions and signed a treaty with the Nazis, even as they understand that much of western capitalist media is propaganda as well. We can’t have any useful discussion on current events at the moment because we have vastly different knowledge of what’s happening, as well as entirely different analytical tools to pick it apart with.
They’re also terrified I’m going to say very extreme things in front of their family (privileged petite bourgeois liberals). I try to be careful but at the same time I won’t pretend to not be a communist. We have political discussions often and I’m not one to just sit those out. I’m sure my family would react poorly as well, but with the geographical distance to them it’s not as present an issue in our minds.
How do you all deal with this? How do you have these discussions and share these ideas with the more soc-dem or liberal minded people in your lives?
I don’t. My partner and I share our views. Her family is left-leaning; and my FIL is or used to be a communist. Coming from a semi-fascist family, let me tell you, it feels pretty neat being able to just be yourself like that. It makes going back to the folks and having to play pretend all the more obnoxious.
I don’t think I can give you any good advice because it’s just too easy to irresponsibly tell the online stranger to dump their partner even though they’re halfway into planning their wedding. I personally wouldn’t be able to repress myself like that or act insincerely throughout a life-long relationship, but I can’t say in good conscience that I’m certain about my judgement of your situation.
In any case, if you end up deciding to go on with your partner, I’d follow comrade @Navaryn@lemmygrad.ml’s advice on “laying low” to buy yourself credibility and not get immediatelly disregarded as a crazy, for your own long-term mental and social health. Also other comrades’ advice on talking about things on “historically neutral terms” so to speak.
Yeah, that is also a thing i should’ve said. It’s a skill in and of itself to be able to get the right points across while dancing around dangerous words.
In the right context, it’s entirely possible to convey messages such as “the last capitalist we hang will be the one who sold us the rope” or “as a leader stalin is unmatched in terms of right decisions” without entering “crazy” territory. Having a good sense of humor helps too, stuff that gets a chuckle is easy to remember.
But i will say this to anyone reading these answers: this comes with experience so get out and talk to people. Yeah maybe you will not get along with everybody but you’d be surprised how easy it is to meet people with similar ideas to yours or people that don’t care enough for it to be a point of conflict.
Get out? Talk to people? Yeah, not gonna happen /s