Mine is fresh highschool graduates getting 2 weeks of training to go work acute, all-male forensic psychiatry. We’re taking criminally insane men who are unsafe to put on a unit with criminally insane women.
…and they would send fresh high school graduates (often girls because hospitals in general tend to be female-dominated) in the yoga pants and club makeup they think are proffessional because they literally have 0 previous work experience to sit suicide watch for criminally insane rapists who said they were suicidal because they knew they would send some 18y/o who doesn’t know any better to sit with them. It went about how you would expect the hundreds of times I watched it happen.
My favorite float technician was the 60 year old guy who was super gassy and looked like an off-season Santa. Everybody hated that guy because they said he was super lazy but he would sit suicide watch all fucking shift without complaining and he almost never failed to dissapoint a sex pest who thought they were gonna get some eye candy (or worse).
What’s your example?
I need 4 years of education and 5+ years of experience to work as an engineer to give people something to look at on their phones.
Police need 6 months of training to make life and death decisions and they get a pension and permanent immunity when they fuck up
POTUS
Elected positions always have that risk, but normally there is some kind of expectation of relevant experience by voters.
some kind of expectation of relevant experience
heh
normally
There has been nothing normal about our elective process since the summer of 2015. And it’s only getting more fucked up across the board.
Imagine if voters only voted for responsible people who would make good presidents.
Cops
In Sweden (and most European countries?) you need a two year education (1,5 yr theoretical, 0,5 yr field training) before you can work as a police officer. I think in parts of US the training is just a matter of weeks/months, which is very little considering the situations one need to handle.
It’s 3 years here in Germany. Seems like some cops in the US are little more than hired thugs.
Or a little less.
While Europe is far ahead in terms of training for police, I don’t think even 4 years is enough.
Very much depends where you live.
I think it’s just true for the vast majority of countries, unfortunately. A country has to have a lot of things figured out and done right before it can regulate and train its police force so well that its population doesn’t nearly universally agree with the ACAB sentiment. Or at least doesn’t belive they’re all incompetent.
Sheriff is an elected position in the US no experience required.
Bonus answer, president of the United States, we’ve elected two mentally deficient celebrities so far…
There’s stories of small towns hiring sheriff’s which were related to the mayor.
And John Oliver’s dive into Sheriff’s in this Guardian Article: Tremendous amount of authority with low accountability’
Police reform is a uphill battle.
Worst are “constitutional sheriffs,” who claim the power and duty to defy or disregard laws they regard as unconstitutional (read: I don’t like this). They essentially try to reign supreme in their counties.
The minutes of training I got before I got my forklift licence is uhhh… Yeah
Did they show you that awesome german workplace injury video?
There are a lot of German industrial safety videos. And they all are slasher films and gruesome to the extent they are amusing to Americans.
For the unfamiliar: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TJYOkZz6Dck
(CW: gore, subtitles)
Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
https://www.piped.video/watch?v=TJYOkZz6Dck
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I’m open-source; check me out at GitHub.
I wish!
Staplerfahrer Klaus?
Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
https://www.piped.video/watch?v=ja7ap6AEuYU&ab_channel=ForkliftVideos
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I’m open-source; check me out at GitHub.
I’m a certified forklift trainer and the training I needed for that was a single day that ended in a simple test…
You’re forklift certified?? I bow to you
The county coroner is an ELECTED position.
I’m a mortician who’s worked substantially with autopsies. To be the county coroner, you do not need a degree, you do not need experience in mortuary science, postmortem science, forensics, pathology, NOTHING. All you need to be the county coroner, is to be popular.
Meanwhile, funeral directors in the USA need to go through years of college and continuing education, because we’re literally the last line of defense when coroners/doctors screw up. I’ve caught dozens of mistakes the coroner has made and I’m sick of it. The most recently was a shaken and bruised baby having cause of death listed as SIDS.
I no longer blindly trust autopsies for accurate cause of death. If the mortician needs 4 years of medical school, the freaking county coroner would should be required for at LEAST that to be elected.
I have to admit I often think about sliding into one of these “prestigious but just need to be likeable with no experience” loophole-esque positions…
But instead of acting like I’m “the boss” and pretending to know what I’m talking about while ruining everything, I’d find the best people in the field and make sure I’m listening to them and supporting them in doing their jobs instead.
Just there to keep idiot managers off peoples’ backs and listen to people who actually know what they’re doing.
I imagine that’s “not how it works”…but still.
Hey, some places it’s the county Sheriff that’s the coroner… which is also bad.
Sometimes people die in the county jail… and almost every time it’s not needed to perform an autopsy- it’s just natural causes…
The coroner needs to be an impartial medical professional.
… That’s disturbing
4 years of medical school and a few years of residency (and maybe fellowship) in pathology. So you’re talking 12 to 16 years of post-high school education because it’s becoming more and more common to have to have a post-bacc or a master’s to get into medical school in the first place.
We have to take additional courses and pass every year, as well as take pandemic response training and mass death psychology/procedure. I even got trained for the ebola outbreak 10 years ago. 2 years of pre-med, 2 years of medical and postmortem science, and a residency which is a minimum of a year, but often longer as it’s based on tasks you have to do. A specified amount of autopsied cases, military cases, decomposition, etc. Then you have to pass your state and LARA exams.
The curriculum included classes for psychology, reconstructive cosmetology, and business law too. I’m a Jill of all trades 😅See, I’m planning on trying to steal your business by going into emergency medicine to be a necromancer. (I have done CPR on people that have actually woken up to complain about it…you cannot convince me that CPR/resuscitation is not necromancy.)
If you want an interesting read, look up cadaveric spasms. I’ve been slapped by a dead body.
It must vary by location. I know I’ve never voted for county coroner. After a little digging, it sounds like my county did away with its elected position over a hundred years ago.
That’s awesome. It’s nice to read that some places are doing away with stupid things.
Being a coroner in some places. Medical examiners are professionals with a degree (and coroner’s usually are too), but the coroner is often an elected position, and elected positions usually only have residency and age requirements. Coroners have a huge level of power because they get to decide what is and what is not murder. Someone dies in police custody? They can call it natural causes, and it never goes to the court system. A political opponent dies by two gunshots? That can be called a suicide.
My grandmother was the county coroner for a while. She was a pharmacist professionally. In those places, it’s more “give it a quick kick and say they’re dead” (she never did that) more than anything else. She only declared death, not attribute cause to my knowledge.
The other part of it is that, for whatever reason, in my county the only higher arresting authority than the sheriff was the coroner. It was her job to serve him with papers when he was being sued and, not that it ever came up, arrest him when it needed done.
Weird system.
In several states the coroner is also the only authority that can arrest the governor as well. Very strange system.
That sounds like a niche power that’d be fun to try out just to see if it works LOL.
“You’re under arrest, governor!”
“On what charges?!”
“Well you’re in a position of power, giving you probable cause!”
[Finds tons of corruption, unsurprisingly.]
Ah yes like the Boeing employees who shot themselves in the head twice.
I’m a mortician and posted something similar. Morticians go through 4 years of medical school, including pathology and forensics, because it falls on us when the coroner screws up… and they have. The case that hits me the hardest was an infant being given SIDS as the cause of death, but postmortem bruising and broken bones told a different story. The owner had to call police and fake a funeral arrangement while he waited for them to arrive.
Mortuary school is an associate or bachelor level degree. Morticians do not go to medical school
My university required 2 years of medical courses; as well as 2 years of mortuary science curriculum. Multiple states I’ve worked in require continuing education in the medical field with exams every year. But every state and university is different. When I was stationed and worked in Colorado, I learned you don’t even need a degree to be a mortician. Any person can shadow a Funeral Director and start embalming. That’s terrifying.
I’ll happily concede that things may have changed. I was in college 10 years ago.
Great, you went to college, not medical school. If someone graduated with a bachelor’s degree in anatomy and physiology, they took more medical related classes than you, but still no one would say they went to “medical school.” It’s deliberately misleading and insulting to the people who actually spend over a decade becoming fully-licensed physicians. Not that dissimilar to stolen valor, frankly. Phlebotomists, nurses, etc all take medical classes and actually go on to treat patients medically, but still no one would say they went to medical school. You do a difficult and important job and you have every right to be proud of it, but you have nowhere near the level of medical knowledge or training of someone who went to medical school.
I get what you’re saying, but I respectfully disagree. I don’t think you understand the course load/requirements for this degree. It might be different for different schools, so I’m happy to elaborate. First of, ignore pre-reqs, like math/english/computer/etc. and let’s just talk science. My university was one of the top in the nation and I was required to take the same courses as doctors for years; I had to compete with them for my grades (bell curves suck); the only difference was that my courses changed direction when it got to classes regarding curing/treating people. You don’t need that for a postmortem science degree, so the next 4 semesters went into strictly death related education.
My university had us thoroughly trained on any potential medical risks, biohazards, and hospital procedures. We were dissecting, helping with autopsies, learning forensics and pathology, training in everything regarding the heart and vascular system, and don’t get me started on all the chemistry/physiology… yes, the courses veered, to avoid teaching us how to cure someone, but that does not take away that we go through medical school.
We are trained to be the last line of defense for catching crimes and doctor’s mistakes; we have continuing education alongside doctors, nurses, and pathologists; we have to work with people who’ve died of dangerous diseases and protect the public… we just don’t have to worry about curing a corpse. If you’ve actually read this, please start your reply with the word autopsy.
Parenting.
Are you sure I’m qualified??
I often wish more of my adult psych patients’ parents had done some reading about psychosocial development and how to support the child at each stage but more importantly I pretty much always wish they’d cared half as much as you did to even ask that question.
For me it is people making food, supplements, and drugs. From their production to their quality department. Just full of people that have no idea what they are doing and making poor decisions. That’s not even to mention the management and owners.
Bonus: Home inspectors / mold remediation “professionals”. Absolutely clueless.
My partner works in food service and always comments that despite what conservative Kens and Karens think, you really don’t want adolescents to be the primary handlers of things you put inside your body, especially not that last little bit where they’re supposed to cook off all the bacteria and viruses.
Pharm tech licensing varies wiiiiidely across the states. Some require natl very, some require basically on job training IIRC.
RPh not so much, but tech also has responsibility not to kill you with a misfill and more eyes are always good for preventing deaths.
The shit wages they pay in relation to being responsible in part for safety and accuracy (in retail) is a big part of why most retail is dangerously understaffed.
Same for insurance agents and real estate agents in many (most?) of US. HS, a couple weeks of “teaching to the test,” and a test is all it takes. Rote memorisation. - lots of those younger folks in insurance couldn’t define what they may/may not say/promise, or who is an “Insured” under a given policy.
I worked at an airport as a ramp agent and it was a minimum wage no experience job where if things fail on an 8/10 level you could cause a plane crash either by terrible luggage distribution or in effective deicing of the planes wings as an aside air canada has lower standard for deice training than most
Excellent example of a “small” job people don’t realize could accidentally kill someone!
It was a fight to get the company to raise the starting wage so we could keep up with mcdonalds, it took every lead hand threatening to walk out during winter when it’s hardest to replace people because of deice training
Having a friend who works as a ramp agent as well (in Italy), I am amazed by the amount of work and security requirements that are needed, and at the same time impressed at how nothing bad happens since everything is so messy that it could collapse anytime
It’s above one of the ALT keys.
MBAs who contract dev work out to India to make a quick buck without realizing how bad the code they’re going to get back usually is.
Shoutout to Raj the QA lead I worked with in India though. That dude’s team was thorough.
MBAs who contract dev work out to India to make a quick buck without realizing how bad the code they’re going to get back usually is.
Ah, but some of them DO know what they are doing! In the IT world, I have seen where people say a job is about 2-3 years, show no loyalty to the company, and so on. But they don’t understand managers are doing this, too. Many KNOW these outsourcers are shitty (or don’t care because that’s not a metric they care about beyond selling points), but in a 2-3 year turnaround time, by the time it’s apparent they don’t work, the people who made those decisions are already gone. They ALSO thought ahead to the 2-3 year plan. Here’s how that goes:
Year 1: Make proposal based on costs. Find someone in Puna who will sell you some package with some bright, smiling, educated people who speak whatever language and accent that makes your pitch. Proposals are made, and attached to next year’s budget.
Year 2: Start the crossover. Puna Corp has swapped out the “demo people” for their core chum bucket. Sometimes, they don’t even change the names. How is an American gonna know that the Vivek Patel they saw in the demo is not the same guy named Vivek Patel who is working with your bitter employees who see the writing on the wall? Sadly to many who don’t care, “they all look/sound alike.” Puna is a product, their employees are a static pattern of commodity. Your people say they are shit, but, “oh, those grumbling employees. Your job is safe! We can’t fire you, you are too valuable!”
Year 3: The crossover has gone badly, but you are already looking for the next company to work for. The layoffs happen, and all the good folks are gone, and replaced by the Puna Corp folks. Things start to go badly, but you already got one foot out the door, charming your way into another company.
Year 4: You’re gone. Your legacy is that you saved a butt-ton of money. You are a success! The product is shit, but that’s not your problem. By the time the company realizes the tragedy, it’s middle manager versus middle manager, all backstabbing and jumping ship. Customers don’t matter, marketing covers up the satisfaction. “Wow,” you say. “Things sure when to shit THE MOMENT I LEFT.” You look fantastic! When you were there, you saved money! When you left, it all went downhill! You are a goddamn rockstar. Then repeat.
I have seen this happen since the 90s with a lot of tech folks. Everyone thinking short term for themselves. Only the customers get screwed via enshittification.
Now I feel stupid that I always assumed they just don’t know better, but this makes a ton of sense - and they can even expect a raise each time they change jobs. So their whole career is based on bullshitting and they for sure make more money than me… I don’t like this thought process
Assholes love to fail upwards.
Having been in this exact same cycle twice myself, all I can say is that IT jobs are boring.
When you add on terrible software crossovers that amp up the stress without any extra income to justify it then that’s when everyone I know starts looking for their next gig.
I’d go a step further than that - MBAs who not only contract dev out to India but go the cheapest route. I’ve worked with both fantastic teams over there and teams that do more harm than good: the difference is what that MBA was looking for. There’s a lot of great engineers and you can build a great team if that’s what you care about. However you won’t get it by looking for the cheapest contractor in the cheapest country
There is no requirement that I am aware of for college professors to have any training in the fundamentals of instruction, and it SHOWS.
That’s because professors are still intended to be researchers first, which makes sense for the cutting edge topics, but there’s a ton of college level fundamentals you need to understand first.
Kind of off topic but mildy related. Have you seen the old Val Kilmer movie Real Genius? Just wondering if you find it a fun watch today or not
9/10 of my graduate professors couldn’t profess their way out of a paper bag. The actually good teachers were limited because they didn’t research enough. Fuck grad school.
I aspired to work in education in college and took a lot of courses on adult education and how to teach people. I recognized that my favorite teachers in K-12 used those techniques , while realizing none of it was done at the college level.
I don’t work in education but I find myself using those techniques all the time in the workplace. And there’s a clear difference between my department’s onboarding and capabilities versus others.
I really noticed this once I found myself at the community college. The school liked to market that you were educated by “working professionals with industry experience.” which translated to the school paying them less than their second, full-time job on top of all the stuff about them not knowing how to teach while they were in charge of the grading of 20+ classes per semester. Prior to that in my experience I had only ever come across professors who were incredibly passionate about what they were teaching or alternatively were incredibly passionate about teaching-itself. it was eye-opening in the most frustrating way.
This is kind of backwards in the aviation world: There’s a whole separate certificate for flight instructors which involves training in psychology, lesson planning and all that in addition to stuff like flying the plane from the right seat, spin training and all that. Thing is, it’s often baby’s first aviation job. A lot of flight instructors are freshly minted commercial pilots and their first lesson is their first revenue flight. You don’t get to go fly jets for the charters and airlines without experience, and where do you get experience? flying smaller, less expensive aircraft. What’s the single biggest demand for pilots flying smaller, less expensive aircraft? Flight schools.
It was a revelation at some point in my young life when I realized that CEOs (and any other executive position) are not the highly trained and capable leaders with grand business acumen that I was led to believe they are. Literally anyone can be a CEO for a few dollars and their name on a business registration with the local government, no training or capability is required.
Horrifying in retrospect to realize how many people lionize executives simply for adopting a title.
Every CEO I’ve worked for, I could do the technical part of their job. I couldn’t do the political part because I’m results and data driven. Their prideful fuckers who yell louder and demand satisfaction and wield their ability to fire you. Fuck CEO 's.
I worked in a bunch of tech.
Startup CEOs are often folks who rolled really high on Charisma and convinced a lot of people to give them money. Often they have a spark of genius, but if they were really smart, they’d hand over power to people smarter than them. That’s how major companies are founded. Then they settle back down.
The dumb ones are egotistical and many end up failing upwards, as they continue being propped up by other until money disappears and they break enough friendships that they end up in jail.
Knew a guy that did that, made some buisness cards and rented a lambo to pick up chicks. It worked shrug
Most CEO positions are just a “boys club” popularity contest…
I think it’s great when people create a small business and are successful. But I roll my eyes when they have a business with 20 employees and put their title as President & CEO on shit like linkedin. Just put owner. Or managing partner.
Apparently management positions. The amount of people in such positions that are full of themselves and are hitting terribad descicions at the same time, all the time, never to improve on that. Is terribly high.
Yeah sure, let’s not involve the construction department of the company with that big move you are “planning” for half a year now. Also only realize you need tons of work done before you can even start that move a month ahead of the due date. Then do a terrible job of getting that sorted. And only have the most basic of time plans for the actual move ready a couple days before they are supposed to happen. Make that time window awfully short because you also need those machines to produce again because you failed to plan extra production to create a buffer for intermediate products. Then go ahead and slash that awfully short time plan on the first day because surprise, surprise… You don’t have a buffer of intermediate products and you really need those machines up and running again so that you can push actual finished products out the door. Also hope for the best which is that the machines just start up and run again… Yes as if that ever worked with complicated machines that are also old now and could just fail completely just from getting moved.
Grade A plan…
A lot of management are coming out of “business schools” that are little more than indoctrination. These people don’t know the difference between a leader and a manager and qualify as neither.
I was blown away when I was promoted to a management position and realized none of the other managers I worked with read any books on management or had any real experience. Many fell into the management position and just kept doing fuck all.
Not saying the overeducated is better. We later got some Wharton grads who were thrown into the management space and they were the most dumbest MFs I ever met. Their theories would go against reality and at no point did they understand the work involved.
That’s the #1 thing. Managers as a position are incentivized to be overly concerned with their own careers and NOT involving anybody who actually does the work, unless it’s as a scapegoat or to steal credit.
Humble people with natural leadership qualities tend to find such roles disgusting…so we get…managers.
When were we working together???
When firing people is difficult, it’s not infrequent to promote them to hire someone useful to backfill.
Those people keep rising the ladder through seniority and attrition.
They never do anything bad enough to get fired and just make everyone below them miserable cuz they don’t understand the business and like to prove that they’re in charge because of fear of inadequacy.
I’m convinced that most people just don’t do very much real actual problem solving work.
Police, Judges, Presidents, Therapists, Executives, the whole US scammer industry of Noctors (“Functional” Neurologists and other chiropractors)
Therapists? Where can one become one without a masters? Or it like a pseudo therapist… homeopathy esque?
deleted by creator
But getting the PhD was the training. So it isn’t that they never received training it is that the training they received sucked and didn’t actually help them in the real world.
LCSW requires a minimum 4 years college education, and an LCSW is not the equivalent of a therapist.
I’m almost certain that every state not only requires at least an accredited master’s degree, but also a state board license that involves at least 2 years of clinical supervision. However, the supervision is based on the honor system of other licensed therapists, so there isn’t much oversight of the quality. Clinical supervisors usually charge for supervision, so there is a conflict of interest.
