u/kimjongUSA - originally from r/GenZhou
Ok guys, aside from all the ideological talk… is it not simply tiresome everyday have to deal and interact with people who are so wildly ignorant about the world? Anti-communism seeps into every aspect of people lives to the point where it becomes an inextricable part of their identity, and the worst part – they have no self-awareness about it whatsoever. [I hate to talk like this because practically any other political ideology can just call others ignorant and complain “why isn’t everyone else like me”, but I’m assuming those of you who are here are here because you are like me and there is something deep down in it that has touched your soul such that you are 100% sure that this is the way forward; it’s not an opinion, it’s a conviction, and it comes from within]
So, to put it simply, how do you function in a capitalist society without being a hermit or otherwise bashing your head against the wall all day trying to convince others of the obvious?
u/what-a-moment - originally from r/GenZhou
I have definitely alienated myself from my megalib friends. But I have a lot of other friends who share our perspective and I have become closer with them. Opening up about issues and not taking things personally is a good skill to have to find comrades out in the wild.u/I_want_to_believe69 - originally from r/GenZhou
Facts.Also don’t be afraid to advertise it. I live in South Carolina, not exactly a communist haven. But I was wearing a shirt with the the hammer and sickle the other day when the termite guy was here at my house. We started to talk about just every day bullshit to kill time and lo’ and behold he’s a dirty commie too. There are more of us out there than it seems.
u/thrower_wei - originally from r/GenZhou
Be safe about it though. Maybe it’s best not to bring it up around armed mega chuds. But there’s probably no harm in mentioning it to someone who doesn’t really talk about politics.u/what-a-moment - originally from r/GenZhou
yeah subtlety is key until you understand who you’re talking to
u/Lumber_Zach_ - originally from r/GenZhou
I counter this. I think it’s dangerous to put yourself on blast like that. Is it a good to let other communists know you’re sympathetic and a comrade? Yes. Is it good to let fascists know you’re sympathetic and a comrade. No.u/I_want_to_believe69 - originally from r/GenZhou
Agreed. To be fair I was in my own home. Not out and about in town.
u/Opening-Whole-5455 - originally from r/GenZhou
You can’t speak to people who have been indoctrinated their entire lives and believe that you can change their minds. People become communists when they are involved in action, when they are involved in union activity, when they struggle against capitalism. This pushes people to the left whether they realize it or not. We need to be in this reactionary environments so that we can lay the seeds and do what we can day by day. You have to learn to speak to them as a friend, and look past the 95% bullshit that comes out of their mouth, and learn when to springboard off of things they say to create real discussions. Don’t preach, ask real questions and help them resolve things they don’t understand about the world. The fact is, when you examine the world using dialectical materialism your coworkers will listen to you, because you are the only one providing answers and solutions they’ve never heard before. Learn to lead, be friendly, make people like who you are and the organizing becomes easier and you will stay saner.u/applejuice72 - originally from r/GenZhou
On Contradiction is literally a playbook in how to achieve just this ^Just use American or ____ country terminology instead of anything that might be specifically for China, although Mao/Stalin/Lenin write almost as if they were speaking today with how relevant their works are.
u/Mundingburrasaurus - originally from r/GenZhou
I just keep these views to myself unless asked, and if asked I deliver only in breadcrumbs that I feel a liberal can digest. Never EVER be confrontational about it unless you need to dunk on someone who came after you.I’d much prefer to try to get a long with people rather than be alienated. Capitalism is alienating enough when it comes to friendships and even family. It is even alienating for non-socialists.
It’s important to have close friends and it would be foolish to exclude a potential real friend over matters like the fate of the world, which are out of our control, and lose out on things like enjoying a drink together.
u/Milbso - originally from r/GenZhou
Also people who see you as a friend will be more likely to value your perspective. If you act judgemental or standoffish people will not be receptive to what you say. Make friends with people and gradually reveal your ideology over time.This is the best option for both your own enjoyment of life and your success in opening other people’s eyes to communism.
u/NedIsakoff17 - originally from r/GenZhou
Joining a party helpsu/TankSquad4Life - originally from r/GenZhou
It really does, but be careful not to make it your whole social life.
u/HailSneezar - originally from r/GenZhou
>is it not simply tiresome everyday have to deal and interact with people who are so wildly ignorant about the world?yes
i workout with a childhood friend in the army. he’s a lt major and he’s beginning to come around because being in the army for over a decade while still having a functioning brain will do that to a mf
when we work out we talk about politics a lot, and a lot of the time i bring up how china handles situations we discuss way better than the west. its pretty cool to see him slowly gaining respect for china.
also i got to preface a lot of western propaganda regarding the ukraine/russia conflict before it happened and i think that was a huge eye-opener for him.
so i guess TLDR in my experience it helps to compare and contrast china in political discussions, be very specific, be prepared to bust out your phone and show them, and always mention how western media never paid to push those stories to the top of their news feeds unlike other narratives
for context i’m a middle aged white man surrounded by other middle aged white men in a republican stronghold of the SW US
u/Kosmologie - originally from r/GenZhou
Yeah honestly this is a really critical question because, frankly, to most Americans at least, people who won’t shut the fuck up about communism are weird and alienating. Best advice I’ve heard from union organizers is “be normal” lmao.Like most people out here are just trying to live their damn lives. At the end of the day politics is written off as irrelevant by most Americans. You are never going to convince anyone to care let alone read Lenin by arguing with them. When you do talk politics, be socratic. Don’t assert your opinions. Don’t even say your stance if they don’t ask you. Get them to explain their opinions, get to the root of them. Seek to really understand, without judgment, why they hold these opinions, and prod at what you think might get them to think harder. With the right questions you can lead them to radical thought without quoting Capital. They need to come around by themselves. And that’s probably not going to happen with one conversation.
Our role is to guide others to the correct path. The keyword being guide, because you can’t force anyone to actually believe something.
In all this you need to respect their intellect, respect their humanity, and recognize that we have all been inundated with propaganda our entire fucking lives, and the opinions they hold aren’t even really their own, nor is that their fault, nor is it on your shoulders to change them.
Also like having some interests outside of politics that you can relate to people via is super important. Get into basketball, enjoy some movies etc. Touch grass, as it were.
u/dahuoshan - originally from r/GenZhou
I have two types of friends, socialist friends I talk politics with all the time, and liberal friends I very rarely talk politics with, its not impossible to push the latter into being the former given time and persistence thoughu/interfaith_orgy - originally from r/GenZhou
This attitude is why people hate communists. The majority of people are not “wildly ignorant” about how much capitalism sucks, unless you ask in a theory-laden way that would confuse the average person. It sounds more like you are wildly arrogant.u/FaustTheBird - originally from r/GenZhouThe majority of people are not “wildly ignorant” about how much capitalism sucks
The majority of Westerners don’t believe that capitalism is an inherently violent system, believe that socialist is despotism, and don’t believe that the US trains death squads to murder innocent civilians.
u/w0kecommie - originally from r/GenZhou
I think people implicitly feel the issues of capitalism, like alienation for example, but don’t necessarily know why they feel that way or how it relates to capitalism as a system. So it’s less about lecturing or teaching people and more about helping them connect the dots which they already have on their own.u/Comrade_Corgo - originally from r/GenZhou
I’m pretty sure conservatives are very ignorant, politically. People can be good at all kinds of things and be smart in different ways, however, if you’re a conservative, you just are ignorant of how the world works. It’s not like it’s their fault or they were born that way, the bourgeoisie broadcast ignorance across their channels and media purposefully in order to confuse workers and lull class consciousness to sleep.I can be aware that my political development is relatively higher compared to the average population, in fact that is necessary to do so that you can be aware of the type of language you use depending on who you are talking to, however I am also realistic in that my own political development can always be improved upon and that there are others who have been and are at a higher level than myself. Everyone has room to learn.
u/kimjongUSA - originally from r/GenZhouThis attitude is why people hate communists.
Nope. People hate communists because they are taught to hate communism. I’ve never even met a communist in real life (in my country)
The majority of people are not “wildly ignorant” about how much capitalism sucks,
Not about “how”, but about “why” and that’s the key point. The opposite of ignorance, to me, is not a subconscious awareness of a problem, but rather knowledge of the facts and root causes of it.
If I’m arrogant for believing that my ideology is correct, I think its safe to say that anyone who believes any ideology is arrogant, and in that case communists shouldn’t be hated more than any other ideologue.
Your comment seems like a strange leftist version of virtue signalling tbh. Calling out a supposed injustice without giving more than 3 seconds of thought to it nor any proposed solutions.
u/interfaith_orgy - originally from r/GenZhou
Dude, it’s Reddit, not my dissertation. By “people,” I am gathering that you may just mean Americans or Westerners. This is the main source of our confusion. That seems to be who you are using the very general term “people” to refer to because, in many parts of the world, Marxism-Leninism and numerous varieties of socialism are popular ideologies. No one is saying you are arrogant for thinking Marxism is correct. Straw man. For Christ’s sake, everyone here thinks Marxism is correct. What I meant is that, based on your tone, you seem to speak down to your fellow countrymen based on the basis that you are ideologically superior for being able to understand exactly why capitalism is an immoral, exploitative system. This is not a way to win people over. The majority of people are working class and, as such, the majority of people know, somewhere deep inside, that capitalism is an exploitative system. They may not have been taught the necessary language to say it in the way you and I can, but that doesn’t make them “wildly ignorant,” just propagandized, mostly propaganda by omission. That is why I said that you seem awfully arrogant.Also, you seen to not have a very good understanding of the concept of virtue-signaling, which is an alt-right buzzword to begin with, so I don’t really know why we’re using it here. And yeah, it’s the internet, so I do have the privilege of being able to call out a problem and not propose a solution.
[deleted] - originally from r/GenZhou
[deleted]u/kimjongUSA - originally from r/GenZhou
nah, I’m just a freshly born commie
u/materialistgirl1 - originally from r/GenZhou
meet people where they’re atu/better-left - originally from r/GenZhou
As you develop as a communist and organizer, this shouldn’t be a problem. You have to understand the world as it is and work from that. You must realize that you are not *above* others, just ideologically developed. If you look down on the masses, you will never connect with them. I will just leave this here: https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/mao/selected-works/volume-5/mswv5\_58.htmu/MatildaWallace - originally from r/GenZhou
I joined a communist party, worked out okay, going portering tomorrow with the comrades, we organise a street kitchen weekly, I hardly have free time lolu/w0kecommie - originally from r/GenZhou
portering?u/MatildaWallace - originally from r/GenZhou
**postering, my bad
u/Invader9 - originally from r/GenZhou
With certain people I’ll talk issues, but i avoid explicitly political words and feign ignorance if i can’t talk on a subject w/out revealing myself (or getting too close) .u/Q8Q - originally from r/GenZhou
Be kind, gracious, and tolerant towards others. We’re all in this together. If you have solidarity, you need to at least meet people half way.u/Bingbongs124 - originally from r/GenZhou
I lived in a frat house in college. One of the main tenants we forced onto new kids coming in was “frat are different, be more normal”. With just us inside it was probably wild to most people. On the outside you must function in society or we wouldn’t keep you. I would literally copy/paste this into any leftist org. Tbh.