[deleted] - originally from r/GenZhou
A communist friend of mine recently told me that in china the CPC and government don’t have that much power, and that the ruling class is basically the capitalists. He concludes that he thinks the most likely path china is on is ‘technocratic social democracy’. He doesn’t rule out the possibility of them becoming “”“fully socialist”“” but he thinks the party and government really need to step up their game for this to ever happen. Thoughts on this? I really don’t know what to think, since my impression previously was that the party and govt. had a pretty tight hold on the country and economy.
Edit: I showed him this post and he said “I don’t give an ounce of a fuck about ppl on reddit. I have no time for a website dedicated to trying to suck one’s own cock.” LOL
[deleted] - originally from r/GenZhou
[deleted][deleted] - originally from r/GenZhou
Yeah I agree. But I’d like to learn more regardless, and go through the critical process.Though one criticism he has of their policies is that they’re not internationalist enough, he thinks that they need to have FP that promotes socialism worldwide. I think his dad is a trot though lmao
u/Kulunja - originally from r/GenZhou
Given the condition of the world that would be unwise. China has rigorously studied the USSR and its successes and mistakes and they realized that one of their mistakes was being too combative w the West when the West still largely controlled the world economy. You can’t efficiently fight back against a capitalist-imperialist system when you’re still a developing nation. Sadly you gotta play along, build yourself and others up, and when the time comes strikeu/Azirahael - originally from r/GenZhou
They ARE promoting socialism world wide.Socialism is WINNING.
China proves it every day.
So does Vietnam, Cuba, Laos, Korea, Kerala, etc
All they have to do to win is stay alive.
Their policy on revolutions is based on what Mao learned.
And what USSR learned the hard way.
USSR helped revolutions across the river.
This meant that those revolutions were not naturally strong. They kicked off early, with soviet support.
Which meant that if support vanished, they failed.
China waits across the river to support ANYONE who makes it across.
Thus ensuring that those who make it, STAY made.
And we are seeing the tide turn right now.
This time, when the world goes red, there’s no stopping it.
u/FreePatArthur - originally from r/GenZhouChina waits across the river to support ANYONE who makes it across.
Thus ensuring that those who make it, STAY made.
And we are seeing the tide turn right now.
Got me hype as hell right now
u/wunderwerks - originally from r/GenZhou
Your friend sounds like a Trot who doesn’t know what they are talking about.u/dornish1919 - originally from r/GenZhou
While I liked what the USSR did, it wasn’t perfect, as many countries weren’t ready for revolution due to geopolitical, cultural and historical differences. Afghanistan comes to mind, a large majority of the people who lived in the rural areas of the country were more conservative and wanted to maintain a theocracy, but those who lived in the cities were split between ML’s and Maoists. Of course, the USSR stepped reluctantly considering it a border dispute, and thus began a long campaign with mixed results. Hell, even after the Saur revolution, there was still a lot of infighting concerning how to move forward. Maoists wanted to develop the country first while MLs wanted to apply a more Soviet model. It was really a mess and I think an example of the Brezhnev Doctrine not working out the way it should have. PRC also did some nasty things during that time, too.
u/parentis_shotgun - originally from r/GenZhouA communist friend of mine recently told me that in china the CPC and government don’t have that much power, and that the ruling class is basically the capitalists.
Is China State Capitalist?
- The backbone of the economy is state ownership and socialist planning. 24 / 25 of the top revenue companies are state-owned and planned. 70% of the top 500 companies are State-owned. 1, 2 The largest bank, construction, electricity, and energy companies in the world, are CPC controlled entities, subject to the 5 year plans laid out by the central committee.
- Workplace democracy in action in the CPC.
- Is modern day china communist? Is it staying true to communist values?
- Didn’t China go Capitalist with Deng Xiaoping? Didn’t it liberalize its economy? Is China’s drastic decrease in poverty a result of the increase in free market capitalist policies?
- Is the CPC committed to communism?
- The Long Game and Its Contradictions. Audiobook
- The myth of Chinese state capitalism. Did Deng really betray Chinese socialism?
- Tsinghua University- Is Socialism with Chinese Characteristics real socialism, or is it state Capitalism?
- Isn’t China revisionist for having a capitalist sector of the economy, and working with capitalists? Why isn’t it fully planned like the USSR was?
- Castro on why both China and Vietnam are socialist countries.
- Roderic Day - China has billionaires.
- What is socialism with Chinese characteristics (SWCC)?
- How is SWCC not revisionist? How is it any different from Gorbachev’s market reforms?
- Domenico Losurdo - is China state capitalist?
- Did Lenin say anything about Market Socialism, or productivism?
- Why do Chinese billionaires keep ending up in prison? Why are many billionaires and CEOs going missing? China sentences Ex-Chairman of a major bank, guilty of embezzling ~$100M USD, to death in 2019.
u/StalinJunior7492 - originally from r/GenZhou
Oh man this is gold, I gotta save this.u/Jizzle02 - originally from r/GenZhou
What an amazing list! I’m gonna be saving this!u/GordonFreeman2005 - originally from r/GenZhou
Fucking golden list. Good job.[deleted] - originally from r/GenZhou
thank you comrade
u/Kulunja - originally from r/GenZhou
Look at the class composition of the CPC. The largest demographic is farmers, then followed by white collar workers and retirees. I don’t think it’s scientific to call the PRC a DotP simply because the working class itself doesn’t have majority control but it’s far from being a DotBu/wunderwerks - originally from r/GenZhou
So office workers who don’t own capital aren’t working class now?! And retirees who were working class are not anymore??[deleted] - originally from r/GenZhou
Yes thinking about this dialectically we might conclude that it’s not necessarily a black/white situation anyway. Likely it would be accurate to describe them as a sort of proto-DotP which has not yet been able to fully develop because of global contradictions outside of China’s controlu/Kulunja - originally from r/GenZhou
I do worry that the CPC isn’t bringing in enough members from the working class. Granted I’m a Westerner and given their successes so far I place my trust in them but the criteria to join the Party is v educationally rigorous that most average workers prob wouldn’t have a chance to even applyu/Azirahael - originally from r/GenZhou
Farmers and office workers ARE working class.u/Kulunja - originally from r/GenZhou
When I say the working class I mean the proletariat, IE those who sell their labor without any administrative control. Presently they only compose 8% of the CPC which is quite low imo. I hope Xi makes it a goal to incorporate more of the proletariat into the CPC in the future[deleted] - originally from r/GenZhou
[removed]u/Kulunja - originally from r/GenZhou
Would farmers not be regarded as peasants?
u/TagierBawbagier - originally from r/GenZhou
Others will have critiqued what he said better. What stood out to me is that he appears to neglect the importance of China’s place in a global context. From an anti-imperialist view and as a fellow superpower of a multi-polar world.Clearly his opinion that China is socdem is solely an incorrect perspective of it’s domestic policies/investment in the economy etc. But that’s not the entire story.
The links here look good, https://www.reddit.com/r/GenZhou/comments/s7favk/comment/hta10ka/?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=web2x&context=3
I’d also check out Prof Wolff who has interesting historical analyses.
u/allinwonderornot - originally from r/GenZhou
One thing I do agree. The government does need to step up their game.u/dornish1919 - originally from r/GenZhou
I guess crushing the west in every facet and slowly becoming the worlds strongest global power and economy isn’t enough for you?u/allinwonderornot - originally from r/GenZhou
The fruit of the revolution is still hanging by a thread. The domestic bourgeoisie is doing everything to stop socialism, many times through social media, and the government is seemingly doing nothing to counter the reactionary domestic propaganda campaign.u/dornish1919 - originally from r/GenZhou
You have no idea what you’re talking about.
