I hate Windows. I hate Microslop. I’ve hated them forever. Not using Windows helps, but I still have to deal with the consequences of everyone else using it!
What I hate most is people absolutely terrified of a *nix terminal, while willing to work around Windows problems via command prompt or messing with the goddamn fucking registry, which is just bloody ridiculous, why not just use fucking config files… but that’s a rant for another time - and people looking at this kind of chatbot interface like cutting edge modern technology when it’s actually just a CLI that doesn’t fucking work. We had these at the dawn of personal computing, except that those ones worked and gave the same response to the same command every time! Look, I don’t like using a terminal either, but at least be honest and consistent about it, people.
One of the things that I’ve slowly gotten more and more irritated about to the point that now it absolutely pisses me off is the way these apps make their advanced markov chains have a persona and pretend to be a person.
The way they use pronouns “I” and “my” “me” drives me mad. It is an APP. It should not be pretending to be a person at all. This gimmick angers me, I tell the stupid thing not to do it every time I feel like torturing myself by using one.
I feel considerably better when it behaves like an app should behave and doesn’t pretend it is a person or individual.
This, so much. I do not need software that pretends to be a human! Even if it wasn’t worse than useless, I’d still hate that part. I do not talk to computers and I do not want the computers to talk to me. It’s creepy.
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Makes me want to hurl when Windows setup says “We’re just getting things ready for you! :)” Fuck off just say “moving files” and give me a loading bar.
Yeah if it’s a tool please don’t make it speak like an individual, I do not need my hammer to speak to me I need it to do its job properly.
I don’t need a talking kitchen knife, I need it to cut things. I agree. Don’t make tools personable, make them work.
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If I ever see any copilot bullshit in my operating system, I’m literally going on a killing spree
Copilot would probably egg you on too
Issa great way to relieve stress uwu
Well, there’s one surefire way to avoid it. Don’t use any Microslop products.
But yeah, it’d be nice if they’d just make a functional and uncluttered OS and actually try to compete in that market instead of shooting themselves in the foot and coasting on enterprise and “it came with my prebuilt computer”.
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Honestly so excited about this for a corporate drone perspective as we play cat and mouse to lock people out of copilot and others. New vibe coded updates seem to have some spectacular failure every patch Tuesday. The computer has suddenly started lieing and it’s microsoft’s fault.
Why am I excited? because this system is becoming untenable and doing the fuckers unbelievable reputational damage. The best is part how Microsoft will never backdown from this madness. I don’t think it’s the terminals that scare people but change does. Microsoft is forcing that change relentlessly on something their livlihood relies on. The selling point there is that you can run the same version of rocky linux for 10 years.
Let’s be real too. Your relatives aren’t going to be buying new hardware. Very few of us are going to afford it now. They are going to be amazed how fast and efficient even a KDE desktop is and it’s going to give them fuzzy memories of Windows 7.
KDE’s neat, but I like Cinnamon myself. Good warm fuzzy Windows XP memories. Especially with an actual Windows XP theme. ; ) (The secret’s in changing the system sounds out for some of the default Windows XP ones. That’s what really makes the warm fuzzy nostalgia hit, more than the right shades of blue and green and visual bits being just right.)
Yeah, that’s about what I’ve been thinking. Eventually people who have no clue about computers will hear about and try Linux, if Windows keeps becoming more and more unusable and unstable. Because Linux might be a little weird, but good old Debian is unbeatable for stability. And at a certain point, all people want is an Internet and office software machine that doesn’t crash daily and doesn’t get a new wheel-of-slop-and-broken-features update every week.
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Eventually people who have no clue about computers will hear about and try Linux, if Windows keeps becoming more and more unusable and unstable.
it me. I’ve been too busy to get it started - but have been setting up an older enterprise computer as a “sandbox” to learn how to use a different OS. Shouldn’t be too hard though- I once figured out how to print “Hello World”. Fr though I wish I was better with coding- I’ve done a decent amount of work with SQL, various Python applications, R, matlab, Arcade, Visual Basic, etc but somehow have managed to glean few useable skills from those experiences 
I mean, that’s me too. I’m definitely not your stereotypical Linux nerd, but I, essentially, tried it out in anger and just kinda realised how much I truly hate Windows and that I don’t have to put up with it and that feels great.
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I assumed everyone else was born with the knowledge but me lol. I’ve been steadily switching to all FOSS programs which is already a nice change from MS office. And like I said, with my limited experience I at least somewhat understand how computers work. So, agreed, it’s a matter of applying that annoyance in a productive way!
I don’t own thigh high socks - but maybe if I pull on a pair of soccer socks extra high it’ll buff my programming skills
I don’t own any programming socks either… or the matching cat ears.
I do have a set of Tigger ears, though!
But I don’t know if they buff my computer skills or if they just make me feel more like a little kid again and thus less scared of breaking something.
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Number of people who are terrified of a *nix terminal but who are willing and able to use the windows command line and edit their registry is 0.
You have invented a person to get mad at, I’m pretty sure.
You have invented a person to get mad at, I’m pretty sure.
Have you never interacted with people who use microsoft or apple products?
Yeah sure. Most of them would never use an OS X terminal or a Windows command prompt, if they even know they exist, which they usually don’t!
Most don’t even know what an OS is, much less how to use a terminal. But “cares enough about privacy to use the terminal to avoid making a microsoft account, but is still installing windows for some reason” is a type of guy that exists
Yes, I remember that post, I enjoyed the dedication to interfacing with windows as if it were a normal, sensible OS, well done good post
I did like that too. I like “dealing with Windows, from the perspective of a Linux terminal junkie who Knows Their Shit” type posts and articles an unreasonable amount. I really like the perspective shift and the pointing out that Windows is not the sensible and well designed OS in these comparisons.
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So many of the problems I see people having in those “I tried switching to Linux” posts stem from not using the (graphical, built in) package manager and wandering around the web downloading loose executables.
And it’s because the one time windows tried to include a graphical package manager, it was actually more of a move to cut valve out, but it was so poorly executed it indirectly gave us Proton.
I know someone who 100% knows what an OS is, is intimately familiar with the Windows command line (or at least knew what he was doing with DOS back in the old days), and talks a big game about privacy and security, but good lord does he insist that Windows is the only PC OS there is that works. It’s not worth the argument. I pretend to be utterly useless at computers when in his presence to avoid having unproductive arguments.
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Can confirm this person exists
Source: is me
I’m 40; I’ve used DOS and know about the command prompt and still use it from time to time.
Ironically the Terminal app is one of the better things Microsoft has put out lately.
A friend of mine who is new to pc gaming was afraid to download a mod from nexus… So I think it’s plausible there are people like that out there
These people do exist. I have met them. I have argued with them. I know someone well who is probably that person, but to find out would reveal to them that I know anything at all about computers and would lead to them attempting to bait me into having arguments that are counterproductive and wasteful and therefore I don’t wish to start them.
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Oh no they do, they’re painful.
Just because of your rant windows will add a fourth settings menu, also with different design, it will blend award winning design of modern tile settings menu and registry editor power via ai commands changing registry keys from futuristic copilot enabled design
That sounds like an utterly broken nightmare.
Please do not give them any more bad ideas.
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it will be audio only
deleted by creator
His uncle works at
nintendoMicrosoft.
GOOD rant
Thanks. I try not to rant about computer shit that doesn’t impact me as badly as those around me and just get on with my life, but sometimes I see some truly insane shit and I just get so mad!
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What do you mean, “MS fans?” Are you telling me there are still people who consciously like MS, rather than just continuing to use its products out of intertia or apathy?
Business nerds love Microsoft. I just had a contractor work with me, IT, he hated Linux and loved windows. He has some sort of VM running Ubuntu inside Windows for his Plex server instead of just running baremetal debian like a sane home admin.
That is the exact face I made. Dedicated machine, VM on windows running Ubuntu. Like why.
You should meet my dad. He’d probably do similar things in a similar context… there is a reason I try not to discuss anything computer related with him and I pretend to be a stereotypical idiot end user who has no clue what an OS is or how a computer works on any level. I pretend to think technology is magic and he’s a wizard.
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He has some sort of VM running Ubuntu inside Windows for his Plex server
Our sys admin would do the same thing before he saw the light and became Proxmox-pilled
instead of just running baremetal debian like a sane home admin
tbf there are a lot benefits to using a hypervisor, like easy backups. Even janky setup like a VM running inside of Windows is better than nothing
Yeah but hes doing it so he can manage the files in file explorer :| its a media server so generally too big to back up if you just want to fill the drive and dont care. Which tbh is what I do on my jellyfin.
He could do that easier by making the linux server present its media library as a samba share
This comment chain reads like you guys are making things up and trying to make us windows users feel like we’re losing our minds
“I’ve sambaed my Debian so I can put files on my jellyfin”
I use Linux, and talking to terminal junkies and real nerds makes me feel like I’m losing my mind, too. Or, rarely, like I’m the only sane person in the room. But mostly I just feel like I’m taking crazy pills.
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Someone could, but not him lol
Interesting dude
He has some sort of VM running Ubuntu inside Windows for his Plex server instead of just running baremetal debian like a sane home admin.
Powerful “knows enough to fuck things up even harder than someone who doesn’t know anything” energy
“Let me access my windows computer so I can access my VM so I can access my docker containers” is the worst kind of inception.
You should meet my dad. He genuinely likes Microslop products. He’s bought a lot of their flops because he believed in the vision and liked the company.
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I would have a frustrating and unproductive argument with your dad
You probably would. 90% of the Linux users on this site would.
I would love to as well! If I didn’t have to deal with him the following morning and never truly hear the end of it. And deal with the fact that as soon as he knows Linux is still kicking around and I’m into it, he’ll find a way to wreck stuff for me over it, because he wrecks everything good that ever happens for me.
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Thanks. I do usually need a hug after having to avoid starting a fuss with him in some way.
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“MS fans” is just the average computer user
Now see, I don’t actually believe that. I think most people who use Windows do so with no particular affection for it.
I suspect that if you were to survey Windows users with the question “Why do you use the Microsoft Windows Operating System?” you would get an answer spread approximately like this:
90%: What’s an operating system?
9%: It’s what came with my computer.
1%: I have to, because some program I need to use only works on Windows.
That’s my point though. I think OP is using “MS fans” weirdly. Normal people just want to use their computer the same way they always did and don’t have an opinion on Microsoft’s corporate policy. I genuinely don’t know how you would explain Linux to your average 56 year old Linda from HR
What’s an operating system?
I’ve used this exact line, knowing full well that I know more about the variety of OSs out there, present and historical, than the guy I’m talking to. To avoid having to have a frustrating and unproductive argument.
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I switched to Debian (with KDE) from Windows 10 (me upgrading my pc screwed something up somehow and was unable to actually get 11) and it seems like 90% of the things preventing me from committing to switching to Linux are now fixed.
Plus it looks great. Windows on my PC has its days numbered, until I finish transferring all my stuff from one drive to the other.
It’s pretty good, huh?
Soon enough you’ll be getting the distrohopping bug… Just remember, most of the time, you don’t want or need a new distro, you just want a new DE (and you don’t need it, you just want it). I’ve had to remind myself of that a few times.
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Microsoft Fans
I’m surprised they exist
I know my brother had at least bought into the prestige at one point when he joined as an engineer team there; and believe it or not that all evaporated fairly quickly after starting lol. And that was before they started forcing engineers to use “AI” for coding - can’t imagine that’s made things better
Probably just middle managers of large companies that are entirely dependent on Microsoft products, I can’t imagine any end user being at all enthusiastic about a Microsoft product.
I think you should meet my dad. At least, he used to be really enthusiastic about most stuff Microslop made. I think he’s less extreme about it now, but he definitely doesn’t hate them with a burning passion or have the other typical end user attitude of apathy.
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TBF The Zunes were pretty cool and I liked the form factor of Surface devices.
I just hate how their flagship product is a slow pos that Uninstalls Calc and of course if forced on every budget machine. So I have people coming in with machines wheezing over basic tasks because they can barely handle the bloat and manufacturers keep duping people into having too little ram…
You’d be surprised, they usually love to lick Microslop’s boot really hard, it’s pathetic really.
Terminals are how you look like a 1337 h4xx0r in front of friends and family.I love 'em in theory!
In practice, they’re kind of scary, I have no idea how to find out how to use it, and of the things I do have some idea how to do, I can do faster with a graphical tool I’m more familiar with.
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It’s definitely intimidating at first but cheat sheets (or straight up googling) can help with a lot of stuff. But in modern Linux, you also don’t really need the terminal for a lot of things; mainly just installing software or updating. So you don’t need to know a lot about it.
Even installing software or updating won’t need the terminal in a lot of distros nowadays, or at least won’t need the user to type any commands.
I still feel like it’s nicer to be able to install from the command line rather than searching out and downloading the binaries.
Definitely, and can be faster too if you know what you need, but almost any major distro has an appstore so that’s easier for the majority of people.
See, that’s interesting. Because you tell me I don’t need the terminal, while loads of other folks say that yeah, sometimes you do, and that’s the best part. Although I suppose a lot of those folks are terminal junkies making some tasks more obtuse on purpose.
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It depends on what you want to do. Like, if you’re just doing basic computer tasks, you can get away without touching the command line. For most other things, there are GUI front ends or utilities that you can find or use, but in some cases learning to use the command line is quicker and easier. Or you make the mistake of starting a home server and suddenly you have to get comfy with the command line because it’s the only way to do stuff.
I have run into situations where the only real solution to a problem is a command line utility, and quite honestly, when they are well documented with precise information and examples of correct usage, I actually rather like them - they tell you exactly what they’re doing and don’t waste resources drawing a window and progress indicators. The problem is poor documentation and thus poor discoverability. A tool to do a thing isn’t efficient if I can’t figure out how to make it do the thing.
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Yeah, I’ve wrestled with my share of poorly documented APIs. It’s a problem with free software - writing the code and solving the puzzle is fun, doing the writeup isn’t, and so that’s when most people give up on a project. Automating documentation is probably not a horrible use case for LLMs assuming they can interpret the code correctly.
In a lot of cases, providing instructions to run a specific command in the terminal is the least ambiguous way to do something. Like if you want to give somebody instructions on how to add a line to the end of a configuration file, you need to consider that they might be using one of a number of desktop environments, file browsers, and text editors, and that maybe the file browser doesn’t display hidden files, or maybe the user has a different locale / language activated and the menu options are named differently. Or you can tell them to run
echo "fluffy_cat_mode=on" >> ~/.config/some_app.confwhich will work regardless of all these possibilities.Obviously there are tasks which can only be accomplished in the terminal, but there are also many tasks which are trivial to do through some settings menu or application which are still given as terminal commands for the sake of specificity.
I understand what you’re saying, and I much prefer when people offering help provide terminal commands like this over when they provide vague directions (like “just add “fluffy_cat_mode_on” to the end of your config file for the program, that’ll fix your issue”, which I could eventually figure out, but telling me where the file is and supplying a command to do it automatically rather than finding the file in my file browser and opening it in a text editor is really handy) or attempt to provide directions that work with the specific graphical tools they’re using, which might not be the same ones I’ve got.
Good lord do I ever hate trying to fix a Windows issue and being given graphical instructions that lead to menus and buttons that don’t exist on the system I’m trying to fix. Just give me the bloody terminal command so I can see if it’s a UI glitch/update or a deeper bug. I still won’t know how to fix it if the terminal spits an error at me, but then I can look up the underlying error instead of sifting through pages of dead ends with pics of the nonexistent option I’m supposed to click just looking up “xxx button/menu missing”. I do not like the CLI, on any operating system, but being told in Linux forums and software documentation to use specific terminal commands to fix things is significantly less frustrating than what appears to be SOP for Winblows troubleshooting. Which I suppose is the result of everyone using the same DE and core graphical tools.
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This isn’t even that farfetched.
If it was, I’d have posted it to /badposting, not /technology.
I wish this was a badpost and not credible. I might not have to use Windows, but I have to socially deal with the frustrations of people who do.
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People who crap their dacks when they see *nix are probably not using the command prompt tbf. That said I would love to see a greater uptake of Linux, I’m half considering switching over with my laptop but I mostly use it for gaming and I (1) don’t know just how many of my games work with WINE/proton (never used either) and (2) don’t know how I would go about restoring my windows install if it goes south. Not really a show stopper. I have a legit license so obviously it’s doable, plus my closest friend works as a sysadmin and is in the final year of his degree in computer science. But it has no removable drive which would be a first for me to install a new os on, and I don’t want to have to sort it out, y’know? I’m confident installing Linux from USB but I don’t know how it works with windows.
Once I’m back in the workforce I may put together a cheap, small form factor PC to run Linux on and get my confidence back with it - it must’ve been over a decade since I last used it in anger…
I switched to Linux mint last year and haven’t had much problems when gaming. Every game I’ve tried is compatible with proton or wine, the only complication I’ve had is modding Fallout 4 being a bit more complicated, but that works as well. I highly recommend switching, especially since Linux doesn’t carry bloatware and spyware owned by Microsoft
Hell yeah
the only complication I’ve had is modding Fallout 4 being a bit more complicated
Nexus Mod Manager is coming to Linux, so it should be easier in the future. There’s also a Linux native mod manager called Limo, which I used for Skyrim, but its a bit of pain to setup correctly. Mod managers for Thunderstore hosted mods, like Gale Mod Manager and r2modman are great under Linux.
https://github.com/Furglitch/modorganizer2-linux-installer for Bethesda games is the easiest and cleaner solution that I found.
MO2 is great, but I think when I tried it years ago there were some issues that made it kind of annoying. I think steamtinkerlaunch should make it easy to use it too.
I linked to the wrong repo LUL.
I updated with the right one, it’s a script to install and use it without needing to deal with winetricks, wineprefix and everything. So it’s easier to use it then installing with steamtinkerlaunch.
Oh that’s super cool, I’ll take a look, thanks!
Eh, you’d be surprised who you’ll meet in certain “tech nerd” circles. Not a lot of people who are comfortable with Windows command prompt and other advanced tools, but shit a brick when they see *nix or just don’t like it for reasons even they can’t really articulate, but they do exist.
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Your laptop’s storage isn’t removable??
There are laptops with soldered storage, not as common as soldered RAM but they’re out there.
Well… No, not really. It’s an SSD. I’m not replacing it if I can help it. No optical drive or equivalent.
This isn’t really any of my business, so I don’t mean to come across as judgemental, I only mean to propose an option that you have. The storage being an SSD doesn’t make it unremovable, it just means you have to open the laptop’s shell. Swapping the SSD would be the cheapest way to protect your windows installation, if you’re really set on preserving it, while giving yourself the opportunity to switch to Linux and get your feet wet again. Gaming on Linux today is largely the same experience as gaming on Windows. If you use Steam, it isn’t anymore complicated than installing the game from your library in the usual way you would on Windows.
Obviously it’s physically possible to remove and replace a drive. Removable storage refers to storage that’s designed to be routinely removed and replaced - optical media, external USB hard drives, etc. It’s easy to say you “just” need to open the shell, but honestly, have you ever tinkered around inside a portable device? I’ve had to - this laptop spent a good year or two banging about inside my backpack while I cycled to and from uni, over an hour each way, so when the screen went black I thought it would be worth seeing if it was just a loose connector that needed reseating, which fortunately it was. In doing this, because the whole thing is largely held together with integral clip features that took some force to undo, I cracked the case and don’t feel comfortable using it as a portable device any more than I have to, now. Yes, it’s possible to replace an internal laptop drive but you don’t “just” open the shell like you would with a desktop case. I also, frankly, can’t justify the expense no matter how minimal, and don’t actually need to switch off windows at this time.
(1) don’t know just how many of my games work with WINE/proton (never used either)
You can check game compatibility on ProtonDB and anticheat enabled games that support Linux on Are We Anti-Cheat Yet?
(2) don’t know how I would go about restoring my windows install if it goes south.
You can create a Windows USB install from Linux, but it’s easier to just make one from Windows before formatting.
Dual booting does work, but I would advise you to have two boot partitions, one for Linux and one for Windows, the reason is that while you can just use a single boot partition for both, Windows is a piece of shit that will mess with your boot entries and delete the Linux entry after an update, forcing you to fix it manually which last I tried was hard to do from Windows.
Yeah, I honestly don’t particularly trust those lists, but… Probably should. If I switch over there’s no way I’m dual booting, apart from anything else I only have like 500gb internal storage. I’d sooner just jump over entirely, I spent a few years running Linux exclusively at home in the early 2000s so I feel confident I could do it.
These sites tend to be good, ProtonDB is comprised of community reports, but tends to be accurate, I think I only found like 1 or 2 games long ago that didn’t run and didn’t have an accurate reporting.
I spent a few years running Linux exclusively at home in the early 2000s so I feel confident I could do it.
That’s cool! I only started messing with Linux in 2018 and from there to today shit is already a lot different, I can only imagine how much different it must be compared to the 2000s.
You didn’t ask, but since you want to game on it, I would suggest you take a look into “gaming ready” distros like Bazzite, Nobara and CachyOS. I personally use Bazzite, but have used Nobara before. Also, depending on your laptop’s GPU you might want to test before going all in, I say that because on the Nvidia side, any card before the 1000 series will have horrible DX12 -> Vulkan performance because of a hardware limitation, I know that because I have one laptop with a 960M iirc that’s also running Bazzite, tho those tend to be newer games that wouldn’t run well on that card anyway.
Thanks for the heads up on gaming ready distros, it hadn’t even occurred to me that that would be a thing. Graphics adaptor is an RTX 3060M, so hopefully shouldn’t have trouble there:) I’ve really not had trouble running anything, yet, certainly not performance wise (touch wood).
You can create a Windows USB install from Linux, but it’s easier to just make one from Windows before formatting.
Annoyingly, you cannot just flash the Wiindows installer .iso image to a USB like any other .iso image. There is a tool called WoeUSB for this though, which does essentially what the Windows installation media tool does on Windows.
I remember having to use WoeUSB once, that’s definitely something that needs to be easier to do under Linux, even if there shouldn’t be a reason to go back to Windows lol. There’s multiple apps to do this, like Balena Etcher, Fedora Media Writer and Ventoy, yet only WoeUSB can create a Windows installation USB.
(1) All of them that don’t require you to install a rootkit will work fine, which means everything but AAA multiplayer shooter garbage
(2) Don’t go back
Are there linux distros that work on apple silicon?
Asahi Linux, although it’s missing some features right now and doesn’t work on M3s or M4s
Fedora asahi remix for m1 and m2 macs.
The more things change, the more they stay the same
At least Windows XP worked. That was peak Windows, for sure. Just went downhill from there. I miss it.
I will give these so called “innovators” credit where it’s due… selling clueless gadget enthusiasts my age (and entirely too many people old enough to know better!) a text interface as brand new technology is a hell of a marketing trick. And it’s impressive on some level that people whose whole job is making good and usable interfaces for computers have managed to take the inscrutable but powerful CLI and turn it into an interface that has no documentation and doesn’t even work.
But yeah, nothing ever really changes with technology anymore. My favourite example to illustrate that is just how many times the dumb terminal or “Internet Appliance” has been reinvented.
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