Over the past half year or so, I have been using two cornes as my main drivers. One at home, the other at my workplace office. I tried four different kinds of switches. I’d like to share how I feel about them.

The switches are:

  • Kailh choc v1 pink (linear, 20 gf)
  • Kailh choc v1 white (clicky, 50 gf)
  • Kailh choc sunset (tactile, 40 gf)
  • Kailh choc v2 brown (tactile, 55 gf)

I used all of them with hot-swap adapters, so they just sit directly on the PCB. No case, no top plate. I attached a piece of children’s sponge rubber to the bottom of the PCB to protect the diodes.

For those unfamiliar with it, trampolining is a modification of the switch where you take the switch apart and insert a small object into the tube of the switch’s stem, preventing the switch from being pressed all the way down.

Kailh Choc v1 Pink

These switches are way too easy to press by accident, either by just resting my hands on the keyboard, or not correctly hitting the center of a switch, touching a neigbour switch.

When you start to push them down, as soon as they leave their resting position, they become very wobbly and shaky, not moving down in a guided, straight line. This, combined with the low switch force, makes a horrible typing experience. I made many typing mistakes, just because of how mushy the keys feel. I used them for two days, and put them back in the box. Praise the hot-swap sockets.

Kailh Choc v1 White

They have some pre-travel before a slight tactile bump, and the click happens just after the the tactile bump. After the click, there is almost no post-travel until they bottom out. I like my switches with as little pre-travel as possible, so theoretically I shouldn’t like them. The tactile feeling, combined with the click feels and sounds good though, they feel responsive and springy.

My problem with these switches is that the actuation point is before the tactile bump, so if you press them only slightly, they actuate without bump or click. Typing on these switches requires a certain sense of passion, every keypress should be a continuous, swingful movement all the way over the click.

Trampolining is not possible, becasue there is not much post-travel after the click.

Both at home and at work, I’m sharing my office with others, so unfortunately clicky switches are a no-go for me, because of the noise they make. I used them for a day at home, liked the feel, but they have too much travel overall, can’t be modded, and are too noisy.

Kailh Choc Sunset

These switches have no pre-travel before the tactile bump, the tactile bump starts exactly at the switch’s rest position. This feels really great. There is some post-travel after the tactile bump until they bottom out. Trampolining is possible.

I trampolined the switches with 1 mm ceramic mill balls. My sister got a sampler of such balls at an exibition, and was kind enough to give them to me. 1 mm reduction of the post-travel is not enough, there is still too much post-travel for my liking. Bottoming out on ceramic feels a bit harsh, but at the same time crisp and defined. The sampler also included 2 mm balls, but those don’t fit in the stem holes of the keys.

My biggest gripe with the sunsets however, and this is a bit hard to discribe, is how scratchy they feel. It is as if the tactile bump itself is not an entirely smooth hill, but there is an ever so slight roughness to it. Maybe comparable to swiping over a mirror with a wet finger. It just feels a bit off. The roughness can be felt both on the way down, and on the way up. The switches came factory-lubed, you can see the lube shining on the stem. Not sure if it has anything to do with the lube.

I have been using the switches for about half a year now. They are much better than the pinks and whites, but definitely not my endgame.

Kailh Choc v2 Brown

This is endgame material. Just like the sunsets, the tactile bump starts all the way up at the switch’s resting position. Contrary to the sunsets, the tactile bump is smooth and satisfying. The switches activate just after the hardest point of the bump, but before the bump is completely over, exactly how it should be. After the bump there is quite some post-travel until bottom-out. These are by far my favourite switches of the batch I bought, especially with trampolining.

The biggest problem with these switches is finding the right keycaps. Since the switches are lower than reguler MXs, standard MX keycaps tend to touch the switch housing. I have two sets of keycaps, one a bit larger than the other. The larger ones go over the switch housing, but just barely. While pressing a key, the inner wall of the keycap scratches along the switch housing. That’s a very unpleasant experience. The smaller keycaps don’t scratch like that, instead they hit the small black rim of the lower half of the switch housing. That happens after the bump, and doesn’t feel too bad.

I tried to trampoline them in two ways, with the 1 mm ceramic balls, and with small sections cut from rubber o-rings. The o-rings were included as dampeners with one of the keycap sets. Again, the ceramic balls are a little bit too small to reduce the post-travel in a meaningful way. With the rubber pieces you are more flexible in how much travel you want to reduce. I made them long enough that the switch bottoms out just after the tactile bump. Sometimes I made the piece too large, preventing the switch from actuating. This is easily fixed though, by taking the rubber piece out and cutting a thin slice off of it with a sharp knife.

Modded like this, both sets of keycaps don’t touch the switch housing anymore, the switches bottom out just after the tactile bump, before the walls of the keycaps come near the housing.

I tried some other materials for trampolining, but none of them worked properly. The sponge rubber I used as bottom layer for my cornes is too soft to stop the key. Bamboo toothpick tips didn’t cut off cleanly and splintered in unusable pieces. Some floral wire I had was too thin.

Rubber o-rings are the way to go. They create a very pleasant rubbery bottom-out feeling. On the pictures you can see the bigger keycaps. The left key has no trampoline and no o-rings. The middle key has a trampoline and three o-rings. The right switch has a trampoline but no o-rings. There is no difference between no o-rings and two o-rings. Only with three o-rings there is a difference. The middle key sits a bit higher than the right key, but the overall travel distance and bottom-out feeling is the same, and is entirely determined by the trampoline. You can see that neither of them goes over the black rim of the switch housing, while the left key goes over the switch housing when pressed.

  • UndefinedIsNotAFunction@programming.dev
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    1 year ago

    Wait a gosh darned second here. Are those effectively high profile caps on low profile switches? Oh man, this just made my day. I love it! Had no idea they made anything other flat boys for chocs XD

  • RustedSwitch@lemmy.world
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    1 year ago

    I appreciate the write up! I have a set of sunsets that just arrived that I’m looking forward to installing. They are replacing red pro’s (35g linear). I’m hoping the scratchiness you mention doesn’t bother me.

    I’d never heard of trampolining - I don’t think it appeals to me, buts it’s interesting how many modification types there are out there.

    • crankin@kbin.social
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      1 year ago

      I have two boards that I regularly swap between, one with red pros, and one with Sunsets. Stock, I found the Sunsets way too aggro, but I lubed them with 205g0, including the tactile bump, and that totally mellowed and smoothed them out. Now they feel goooood! So just something to keep in mind.

      • RustedSwitch@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        I’m not sure I’m ready for the level of time/patience commitment required for that! 42 switches… a switch opener… a lube station… holy hell.

  • luckybipedal@lemmy.world
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    1 year ago

    Nice write-up! Out of the Choc switches I’ve tried, Sunsets are my favourites, too. I agree that Pinks are too light. I lubed mine and don’t find them wobbly, though. Pro-Reds are borderline for me. I think part of the problem is the flat MBK key profile that makes the edge of the next key too easy to hit by accident. Too bad LDSA key caps never came back in stock.

    I find the Sunsets are more scratchy when I hit them off-center. If I hit them just right, they feel smoother than MX Clears and more satisfying than MX Browns I have on other boards.

  • iZRBQEcWVXNdnPtTV@lemmy.world
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    1 year ago

    I really wish low force switches could be more stable :( My 12g chocs were the most comfortable typing experience I’ve ever had in terms of RSI pain reduction and ergonomics, but they also kinda suck in other parts of the experience.

  • anaumann@lemmy.world
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    1 year ago

    I assume the Brown V2 are nothing like the V1 then. (Because those just lack a well-defined tactile bump). Might be worth trying them then.

  • Siegvar@lemmy.world
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    1 year ago

    I appreciate the in depth writeup! Made me want to relate and share my experiences too. My journey took me from choc v1 whites -> robins -> sunsets -> browns -> pro reds…

    Whites I really liked the whites, but like you, the inconsistent and occasional pre-bump activation drove me nuts.

    Robins I thought these were supposed to be lighter than the whites but are actually heavier. I was mistaken and disappointed. The colour and sound is really nice though.

    Sunsets The sunsets were really hyped up and also really good, but I realised I like a little bit of pre-travel rather than a bump right at the top, and I like the lighter, crisper clicky feeling of the whites than the seemingly heavier bump on the sunsets.

    Browns Meh. Their reputation precedes them and while I don’t think they’re as horrible as the memes make them out to be, I don’t really feel any unique value it provides that would make me pick them over the others.

    Pro Reds Right now my daily driver has pro reds installed, and I’m surprised by how much I’m adapting to linears. I’ve hated linears on MX-switch based keyboards so thought I would hate it here too, but I actually don’t mind it with the shorter travel of the chocs compared to MX switches.

    This is also my first attempt at going with significantly lower actuation weight switches and at first I was skeptical, but like many others, after adapting to it I really like it. I can imagine pinks being way too light though. I’m considering trying the 40g greys/silvers sometime? Don’t know how much of a difference 5g will make, but I do feel like it might suit me a smidge better since I like to rest my fingers on the keys and I still get the occasional unintended keypress with the pro reds.

    v2 Browns I’m really surprised by what you’be described about the v2 browns, it sounds like a whole different beast from the v1 browns and much closer to the sunsets in overall character. Now you have me tempted to look for a choc v2 board to test it with.___

    • user42212@lemmy.worldOP
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      1 year ago

      By the way, the click in the Kailh v1 whites is removable. When you open them, there is a small spring at the back of the stem, opposite side of the actuation feather. You can remove it very easily, and you have linears.

      • Siegvar@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        Good to know, although in that case wouldn’t I be better off picking from the many linear options already available? Sorry, genuinely asking, not sure if I’m missing some context behind that advice.

        I like clicky keys. I like the feedback, but the inconsistency in relationship between the click and actual actuation in the v1 whites annoyed me. I first thought it was maybe just a bad batch of keys but after learning more about the actual click mechanisms and the general tolerances required it seemed like an inevitable flaw in the design?