u/Anti_Terrestrialist - originally fromr/GenZhou
CPUSA isn’t so black and white, or static, as some make it out to be. they’ve had positions that I think I’d call “liberal” but they’re communists still. like supporting the democratic nominees in presidential elections, I strongly disagree with it, and I’d characterize it as liberal, but they’re reasoning is coming from a communist POV, if that makes sense.
it’s a big party with a large somewhat diverse membership, they’ve clearly moved further into the ML camp (from being more revisionist and “liberal”) in the last few years and we’ll just have to see which factions of the party win out. they’ve gone through some big changes over the last 100 years. I’m no expert on this history but reading Black Bolshevik gave me that impression.
there’s the question of infiltration as well, but that frankly should be expected in an org that’s been around that long and has had so much history, with such a (relative to American socialist parties) large membership.
like supporting the democratic nominees in presidential elections
I don’t know that I would interpret the CPUSA supporting a candidate as a whole but more a specific policy or ideal that aligns with progress. In other words, if the the choice is between a politician who is for universal healthcare or not, then we should support the candidate who is in favor of universal healthcare even though we know they will likely not be able to pass it while we also work to organize, increase class consciousness, and grow the vanguard party. We should be able to work tomorrow all these things at the same time.
Revolution and overthrowing the government is the only way to change the system but we must also try to incrementally improve the lives of the working class because doing so will help lead to the former. How so? Well, you can’t grow as a vanguard party by not fighting to improve the lives of the working class people. No one wants to hear, “there’s no time for better wages, we need to overthrow the government!”. People need help now.
I don’t necessarily think you disagree with this perspective, I just wanted to provide a thorough explanation for anyone else reading.
u/Anti_Terrestrialist - originally fromr/GenZhou
thanks for this explanation, this is definitely the reasoning I’ve seen for CPUSA’s policies.
my disagreement comes from the support for candidates like Clinton and Biden. I don’t think they have any track record of moving towards progress and I’m extremely skeptical of claims that they’re the lesser evil against someone like Trump (Biden’s presidency is proof of this). If it were someone like Bernie though, that’d be a different conversation since he’s someone that does actually support universal healthcare, etc and would do a lot to legitimize socialism in the minds of liberals. although I have no illusions about him being able to pass a lot of that stuff or him still being an imperialist.
Well, you can’t grow as a vanguard party by not fighting to improve the lives of the working class people. No one wants to hear, “there’s no time for better wages, we need to overthrow the government!”. People need help now.
100% agree. we’ll never gain support of the people by posturing and poo-pooing any genuine attempts of workers to make their lives better.
u/Anti_Terrestrialist - originally from r/GenZhouCPUSA isn’t so black and white, or static, as some make it out to be. they’ve had positions that I think I’d call “liberal” but they’re communists still. like supporting the democratic nominees in presidential elections, I strongly disagree with it, and I’d characterize it as liberal, but they’re reasoning is coming from a communist POV, if that makes sense.
it’s a big party with a large somewhat diverse membership, they’ve clearly moved further into the ML camp (from being more revisionist and “liberal”) in the last few years and we’ll just have to see which factions of the party win out. they’ve gone through some big changes over the last 100 years. I’m no expert on this history but reading Black Bolshevik gave me that impression.
there’s the question of infiltration as well, but that frankly should be expected in an org that’s been around that long and has had so much history, with such a (relative to American socialist parties) large membership.
u/1catcherintherye8 - originally from r/GenZhouI don’t know that I would interpret the CPUSA supporting a candidate as a whole but more a specific policy or ideal that aligns with progress. In other words, if the the choice is between a politician who is for universal healthcare or not, then we should support the candidate who is in favor of universal healthcare even though we know they will likely not be able to pass it while we also work to organize, increase class consciousness, and grow the vanguard party. We should be able to work tomorrow all these things at the same time.
Revolution and overthrowing the government is the only way to change the system but we must also try to incrementally improve the lives of the working class because doing so will help lead to the former. How so? Well, you can’t grow as a vanguard party by not fighting to improve the lives of the working class people. No one wants to hear, “there’s no time for better wages, we need to overthrow the government!”. People need help now.
I don’t necessarily think you disagree with this perspective, I just wanted to provide a thorough explanation for anyone else reading.
Comradely
u/Anti_Terrestrialist - originally from r/GenZhouthanks for this explanation, this is definitely the reasoning I’ve seen for CPUSA’s policies.
my disagreement comes from the support for candidates like Clinton and Biden. I don’t think they have any track record of moving towards progress and I’m extremely skeptical of claims that they’re the lesser evil against someone like Trump (Biden’s presidency is proof of this). If it were someone like Bernie though, that’d be a different conversation since he’s someone that does actually support universal healthcare, etc and would do a lot to legitimize socialism in the minds of liberals. although I have no illusions about him being able to pass a lot of that stuff or him still being an imperialist.
100% agree. we’ll never gain support of the people by posturing and poo-pooing any genuine attempts of workers to make their lives better.