u/Angel_of_Communism - originally from r/GenZhou
Sorry no.
Other than an ‘office of planning society on earth 2.0’ i can tell you i know a good bit more about this subject than most, having done this scenario in planning sessions, stories and game writing.
Either the colonists from earth land on earth 2.0 with enough tech to skip some or all of the production issues, or they do not.
If they lose it all, then no, they MUST go through the stone age etc.
No amount of knowledge will get you steel tools without the infrastructure to build them. Which is: coal mining or coke production, charcoal production, iron ore mining, the tools to mine iron ore, and the key part: enough surplus food to support a group of people who break rocks all day, and do not hunt or farm.
If you want a personal demonstration, go play minecraft.
Read all the wiki pages about spells and diamond armour.
Then play the game, start with nothing and jump to diamond armour without passing through the ‘wooden pickaxe’ phase.
Can’t be done.
Because the infrastructure must be built first.
With a head start, such as advanced hydroponic greenhouses, and power, and computerized education, and tools, a colony can jump some of the steps.
But to make it sustainable, they will need the infrastructure.
Feudalism needed the infrastructure of iron & steel. Which required coal, iron mining, and iron tools to mine it, and someone to make that, and also enough surplus food to support the people to do it. Which can only happen when the farming technology has advanced enough to allow that.
Industry needs more of the same. Only advanced agriculture and the like can support masses of people working, and not farming.
And coal for steam power.
Socialism needs even more advanced infrastructure. So much food and other material stuff that society can survive even with nearly everyone else NOT making food and such.
such a colony would only be able to survive with massive imports of food & material from the motherland, and with a huge population base. Essentially dropping a small country on a planet.
u/Lenins2ndCat - originally from r/GenZhou
I’m not disputing most of that, other than the assumption that you can not construct those things under a socialist ideology rather than a slave, feudal or capitalist ideology. We are using the capitalist organisation of production to construct what we need to transition into socialism in several countries right now while maintaining proletarian control and the communist ideology.
My point here is that our understanding of society is a science, and that does not need reconstructing as it can not be lost unless we fail to educate in that new society. We wouldn’t necessarily construct a feudal society again because why would communists sent to a new planet create kings and nobility? I don’t think they would. They might design production in a feudal way but without the hierarchy. A proletarian society(in character) with a feudal level of production.
u/Angel_of_Communism - originally from r/GenZhouSorry no.
Other than an ‘office of planning society on earth 2.0’ i can tell you i know a good bit more about this subject than most, having done this scenario in planning sessions, stories and game writing.
Either the colonists from earth land on earth 2.0 with enough tech to skip some or all of the production issues, or they do not.
If they lose it all, then no, they MUST go through the stone age etc.
No amount of knowledge will get you steel tools without the infrastructure to build them. Which is: coal mining or coke production, charcoal production, iron ore mining, the tools to mine iron ore, and the key part: enough surplus food to support a group of people who break rocks all day, and do not hunt or farm.
If you want a personal demonstration, go play minecraft.
Read all the wiki pages about spells and diamond armour.
Then play the game, start with nothing and jump to diamond armour without passing through the ‘wooden pickaxe’ phase.
Can’t be done.
Because the infrastructure must be built first.
With a head start, such as advanced hydroponic greenhouses, and power, and computerized education, and tools, a colony can jump some of the steps.
But to make it sustainable, they will need the infrastructure.
Feudalism needed the infrastructure of iron & steel. Which required coal, iron mining, and iron tools to mine it, and someone to make that, and also enough surplus food to support the people to do it. Which can only happen when the farming technology has advanced enough to allow that.
Industry needs more of the same. Only advanced agriculture and the like can support masses of people working, and not farming.
And coal for steam power.
Socialism needs even more advanced infrastructure. So much food and other material stuff that society can survive even with nearly everyone else NOT making food and such.
such a colony would only be able to survive with massive imports of food & material from the motherland, and with a huge population base. Essentially dropping a small country on a planet.
u/Lenins2ndCat - originally from r/GenZhouI’m not disputing most of that, other than the assumption that you can not construct those things under a socialist ideology rather than a slave, feudal or capitalist ideology. We are using the capitalist organisation of production to construct what we need to transition into socialism in several countries right now while maintaining proletarian control and the communist ideology.
My point here is that our understanding of society is a science, and that does not need reconstructing as it can not be lost unless we fail to educate in that new society. We wouldn’t necessarily construct a feudal society again because why would communists sent to a new planet create kings and nobility? I don’t think they would. They might design production in a feudal way but without the hierarchy. A proletarian society(in character) with a feudal level of production.