And then Ukraine happened. I realize this is probably the same logic that Holocaust or Sandy Hook deniers use, but it really is fascinating just how many people can be fooled by propaganda or group think. Even when the facts are staring in their faces they just don’t want to hear it.
First time? Those of us old enough to remember the aftermath of 9/11 have seen this all before.
This is worse than 9/11. 9/11 resulted in a sustained anti-war movement that ultimately did nothing tangible, but at least it was there. Now there is no real movement against war. Almost all westerners have accepted war and American imperialism as a fact of life and they like it.
It’s better and worse in some ways.
Ukraine is better than 9/11 in that 9/11 ended up with nearly 3 million Afghan and Iraqis killed, and it doesn’t look like we’ll hit those numbers again. It’s also better that (so far) NATO hasn’t done anything extra stupid like invaded Russia.
Ukraine is worse than 9/11 in that we should have learned by now… but here we go again.
Yes that’s what I meant. I was comparing the social situations not death toll. Of course 9/11 will hopefully remain unmatched in their death toll.
There’s so many more examples from the past too, it’s always a thing ever since the original Cold War and the ClA and Ml6 endlessly printed propaganda everywhere
I don’t understand why so many people seem to be extremely confident in their uninformed and completely one-sided opinions… the worst thing is the extreme hostility toward dissenting views.
For example, if someone told me that they thought the Holocaust didn’t happen, I could act in good faith and easily show them primary sources (e.g. documentation from the Nazis themselves), the actually global consensus (unlike anticommunist propaganda, which is far from universally accepted), and how the leaders’ public statements reflected their behaviour (whereas Stalin’s writing and his alleged crimes are completely opposed). But if I say anything positive about a former or current socialist country, I’m a brainwashed genocide-denying conspiracy theorist who needs to read more reputable Western history books.
Being informed about current events (or allegations) is more difficult in some ways, but easier in others – we have older Western sources debunking their newer claims, we have actual video of what’s being done to the people in the LPR/DPR, we have a fuckton of evidence about what Amerika and other NATO countries have been doing globally for so many decades, etc., but so many people seemingly don’t give a shit
This. Today i was arguing with a vaushite on Twitter and when i questioned the evidence behind “north korea does genocide” he said “yeah and what if i said where is the evidence the holocaust happened? You cant just say that”. According to these morons, holocaust denial isnt bad because the evidence is overwhelming, no its bad because the official establishment says it happened and you cant question that. Literal NPCs
NPCs are real and it’s scary. Some people are just content to not think critically about shit they see on TV.
Oof
if you read history correctly or followed the details nobody wanted to talk about (because conspiracy boohoo) then you should notice, that the same group that was behind 911 is behind the Ukraine war. the Iraq war, the Syria war and all the other wars. it is always the same people, same tactics, same fearmongering, scapegoating, “with us or against us”-dichotomy, gaslighting, alienation of dissenting voices (Actual journalism) and the bipartisan enforcement of the same groups profit and the same geostrategic paradigm since 1945 and before.
Ukraine is the long end of 911 which is the long end of JFK which is the culmination of Condor/Gladio/Staybehind/Ergenekon in one giant leap which is the culmination of Paperclip/MkUltra.
same families, same corporations, same groups, same interests, same sheikdoms, same halford-mackinder bullshit, same enemies, same everything.
All because US historians and lobbies saw the nazis warcriminals and their perception of the soviet union& communism as more important than the perception of their victims of the soviet side. Because think tanks and publishing syndicates are all in the hand of a few families who are part of the media monopoly.
all because america is run by former slaveowner families who supported the nazi and wanted to prevent a workers revolution on their soil (and before that in their investment backyard, germany)
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I had a similar eye-opener moment being in Hong Kong during the riots.
It was nothing like how the media was portraying it. But even friends overseas wouldn’t believe me when I told them hos fucked the coverage was.
The amount of power the average person gives the media over how they perceive the world is terrifying.
Lmao there are actual Sandy Hook deniers?
Propaganda can fool most people. Think about it, if you were a billionaire you could buy all the media and news in a country and convince everyone that the moon landing was faked or that aliens exist. All you need is money to do this. This is capitalism.
there are actual Sandy Hook deniers
IIRC Stephen Seagal is one. I distinctly recall him claiming it was staged by the US government to stamp down on gun rights.
Just because the majority believes something, doesn’t make it true or morally correct. Note that at one point most Americans openly believed in slavery, white supremacy and were rewarded for genociding natives.
Propaganda is a tool that works. The bourgeoisie controls the media and therefore controls the narrative that most people in capitalist nations here. Opposing narratives are suppressed and dismissed making it even easier to influence people.
I used to cling to DemSoc as a way to keep the people fully involved, but like… Pinochet. And also just look at US politics, the majority are(besides certain material matters, like free healthcare, free college and WeEd) completely pro-right wing agenda. Bernie is a SocDem and he’s like the biggest “left” icon in the US. The average American doesn’t know shit about the CIA, the IRA or the USSR, they are brainwashed, why trust what they say? If we put a vote to whether or not slavery is cool in 1700s Philadelphia, I wouldn’t give a shit what they say, they are plain wrong even if they are the majority. Only with Revolutionary theory can guide the proletariat, not the opinions of the masses
