• @folaht
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      1 year ago

      Blowing up the Nordstream pipelines, which I don’t think they did.
      But the US is letting everyone know they’re glad that Germany’s economy is now drowning in deep waters without a lifevest.

      • @Franfran2424
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        211 year ago

        It literally was the USA, they had conducted practices with unmanned mine-removal drones in April, and they had ships and their helicopters in the area the same time it happened, before leaving just after it exploded.

        Seriously there’s no secret, they did it.

        • @folaht
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          1 year ago
          1. Sabotage is usually done by a weaker party to either foment a rebellion or to get two strong parties blame each other in order to distract one or two of them from suppression.
          2. Explosions were done at the easiest to reach places from an EU standpoint still in international waters, further suggesting that whoever did this, doesn’t have that much of a reach.

          No claims or official blames were done.
          Russia explains why it’s stupid to suspect them, while the US reacts as if caught off-guard and trying to spin it as something positive.
          Unbelievably callous, arrogant and stupid of the latter.
          In fact, I would say it’s reaction is arguably worse than the actual act of blowing up the pipelines for one’s own benefit, but it’s in line with how the US speaks the truth today.

          This means it’s likely a weak EU nation or EU candidate nation that got fed up with Germany and doesn’t have too much of an alliance with Russia or is really really angry at Russia and doesn’t care that Germany will suffer in the process. The nation also doesn’t import gas via the Nordstream pipeline, as blowing it up would then hurt itself just as much it would Russia or Germany.

          That leaves me with Ukraine and Hungary.

          Ukraine, because they just lost four regions to Russia and hate Germany for not hating Russia enough. They’re losing the war and they’re getting desperate.

          Hungary, because Germany disbanded EU’s nation states veto power and Hungary doesn’t want to sanction itself, because doing so would tank their economy like no other nation in the EU, so they’re getting desperate and need a distraction.
          Hungary’s affiliation with Russia is very recent, so there are no strong bonds between them.

          • @cfgaussian
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            101 year ago

            It is absurd to suggest it could have been done by Hungary. Hungary doesn’t even have a navy or access to the sea. They are also very strongly opposed to anything that disturbs european energy markets, they were pretty much the only EU member who stood firm against oil and gas sanctions. There is a lot of criticize about Hungary and its quasi-fascist government, but this is not something they could or would do.

            Poland on the other hand is a much more likely suspect. The UK as well. But either way whoever did it will have had the permission and support of the US. Likely Denmark and Sweden had to also be involved because it was right in their backyard. But imo it’s pretty clear this was a US job: they’re the only ones who had all three: means, motive and opportunity. Look at where their navy assets were located in the Baltic just before.

            • @folaht
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              1 year ago

              Poland on the other hand is a much more likely suspect. The UK as well.

              All of them except Hungary, Ukraine and to a much lesser extend the US would be shooting themselves in the foot even more than they have now.

              Hungary not having a navy would be a reason to think people will exempt them from suspicion.
              But all you need is a single boat, a robot submarine with camera and four explosives.

              There is a lot of criticize about Hungary and its quasi-fascist government, but this is not something they could or would do.

              It’s not a criticism saying Hungary is capable of it or having a motive to do it. It’s what I would have done if I were Hungary.
              If I were forced to put sanctions on myself or be put sanctions by the group I’m in, then I feel put in situation where I’m being attacked and I’m not given a way out.
              So I would have to make one myself.
              In fact I remember having done something like that myself.
              New at college there were a couple of unfunny pranksters and I told new friends that we should collectively stand up against them. And those “friends” just bailed on that idea telling me that one should just take the blows and ignore them. That cowardly behavior disgusted me and since I couldn’t fight against multiple people alone, I sabotaged some stuff of the pranksters and left clues that would point to the cowards.
              Then I watched them fight each other.

              They are also very strongly opposed to anything that disturbs european energy markets, they were pretty much the only EU member who stood firm against oil and gas sanctions.

              And they are no longer allowed to, which puts them in a predicament.
              von der Leyen is a bully, while Scholz is a coward.